• Re: Including partman-hfs to the team's git project

    From Holger Wansing@21:1/5 to John Paul Adrian Glaubitz on Mon May 2 16:20:01 2022
    Hi,

    John Paul Adrian Glaubitz <glaubitz@physik.fu-berlin.de> wrote (Thu, 15 Apr 2021 08:28:52 +0200):
    Hi!

    I created a partman-hfs package that is required for the installation of PowerMacs but will also allow to create HFS and HFS+ partitions on any machines. It might be useful on Intel Macs as well for creating shared partitions for dual-boot Macs.

    While including the necessary hfsprogs-udeb in debian-installer is a bit tricky due to the non-free license of src:hfsprogs, I was wondering whether it would be okay nevertheless to include the git repository for partman-hfs packaging in the debian-installer's team project?

    Apparently I did not got the point regarding non-free here, when reading
    this mail that day.

    Now I see that partman-hfs is in contrib, and that opened my eyes.
    I wonder if it's ok from the license point-of-view, to have a installer
    module from contrib in the installer?
    Doesn't this turn the whole installer into a no-longer DFSG-free piece of software?
    Or in other words: can we call such installer the "official Debian-Installer"?


    (There is another issue about non-free firmware to be included in the installer, and unofficial installer images were introduced for this; maybe
    this is a similar thing?)


    Ahhh, another thought comes to mind:
    maybe this partman-hfs is for ports releases anyway, and not to be used in official release archs?


    Holger


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    Holger Wansing <hwansing@mailbox.org>
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  • From John Paul Adrian Glaubitz@21:1/5 to Holger Wansing on Tue May 3 10:30:01 2022
    Hello Holger!

    On 5/2/22 16:10, Holger Wansing wrote:
    Apparently I did not got the point regarding non-free here, when reading
    this mail that day.

    Now I see that partman-hfs is in contrib, and that opened my eyes.
    I wonder if it's ok from the license point-of-view, to have a installer module from contrib in the installer?
    Doesn't this turn the whole installer into a no-longer DFSG-free piece of software?

    Only if you build CD images with the packages included which is not happening by
    default. I would argue it's similar to non-free images that are being built with firmware included.

    Or in other words: can we call such installer the "official Debian-Installer"?

    (There is another issue about non-free firmware to be included in the installer, and unofficial installer images were introduced for this; maybe this is a similar thing?)

    Yes.

    Ahhh, another thought comes to mind:
    maybe this partman-hfs is for ports releases anyway, and not to be used in official release archs?

    It's part of unstable, so in principal, it can be used to build non-free installer
    images.

    Unfortunately, debian-cd currently seems unable to include udebs from contrib and non-free which is why this has to be enabled in the codebase first anyway.

    However, I would appreciate it if you could add partman-hfs to the translation project so it gets translated as all the other d-i packages. You are also very welcome to perform uploads of the partman-hfs package yourself.

    As for the license issue: The hfsprogs package has been in main for a long time but then someone raised the severity of this license bug to serious and the package had to be moved to non-free [1].

    I would still argue that Apple's APSL should not be considered non-free, especially
    since Fedora ships the hfsplus-tools package with their normal distribution [2] and
    Fedora is known to be very strict when it comes to license questions.

    Adrian

    [1] https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=666707
    [2] https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/hfsplus-tools/tree/rawhide

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    : :' : Debian Developer
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  • From Holger Wansing@21:1/5 to John Paul Adrian Glaubitz on Wed May 4 16:40:01 2022
    Hi,

    John Paul Adrian Glaubitz <glaubitz@physik.fu-berlin.de> wrote (Tue, 3 May 2022 10:22:35 +0200):
    Hello Holger!

    On 5/2/22 16:10, Holger Wansing wrote:
    Apparently I did not got the point regarding non-free here, when reading this mail that day.

    Now I see that partman-hfs is in contrib, and that opened my eyes.
    I wonder if it's ok from the license point-of-view, to have a installer module from contrib in the installer?
    Doesn't this turn the whole installer into a no-longer DFSG-free piece of software?

    Only if you build CD images with the packages included which is not happening by
    default. I would argue it's similar to non-free images that are being built with firmware included.

    Or in other words: can we call such installer the "official Debian-Installer"?

    (There is another issue about non-free firmware to be included in the installer, and unofficial installer images were introduced for this; maybe this is a similar thing?)

    Yes.

    Ahhh, another thought comes to mind:
    maybe this partman-hfs is for ports releases anyway, and not to be used in official release archs?

    It's part of unstable, so in principal, it can be used to build non-free installer
    images.

    For which archs is this used?

    Unfortunately, debian-cd currently seems unable to include udebs from contrib and non-free which is why this has to be enabled in the codebase first anyway.

    However, I would appreciate it if you could add partman-hfs to the translation
    project so it gets translated as all the other d-i packages. You are also very
    welcome to perform uploads of the partman-hfs package yourself.

    As for the license issue: The hfsprogs package has been in main for a long time
    but then someone raised the severity of this license bug to serious and the package had to be moved to non-free [1].

    I would still argue that Apple's APSL should not be considered non-free, especially
    since Fedora ships the hfsplus-tools package with their normal distribution [2] and
    Fedora is known to be very strict when it comes to license questions.

    So even if partman-hfs is not used by default currently, the translations are currently used (translators work on it, if we add partman-hfs to the
    l10n machinery), so I wonder if this introduces a license issue for the translation files?
    (The po files contain the hint:
    "This file is distributed under the same license as debian-installer.")


    Holger


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  • From Holger Wansing@21:1/5 to John Paul Adrian Glaubitz on Fri May 6 23:30:01 2022
    Hi,

    John Paul Adrian Glaubitz <glaubitz@physik.fu-berlin.de> wrote (Tue, 3 May 2022 10:22:35 +0200):
    However, I would appreciate it if you could add partman-hfs to the translation
    project so it gets translated as all the other d-i packages.

    Now done.

    You are also very
    welcome to perform uploads of the partman-hfs package yourself.

    Hmm, I guess there's some black magic to be performed by kibi to gain me
    upload rights for this new package...

    Kibi?


    Holger



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    Holger Wansing <hwansing@mailbox.org>
    PGP-Fingerprint: 496A C6E8 1442 4B34 8508 3529 59F1 87CA 156E B076

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