1. Forum
  2. Usenet
  3. LINUX.DEBIAN.VOTE

  • CRA and PLD vote status

    From Kurt Roeckx@21:1/5 to All on Wed Nov 29 22:50:01 2023
    Hi,

    I've updated the page at https://www.debian.org/vote/2023/vote_002 which
    the current status.

    We're at the maximum discussion period of 3 weeks, so the vote will
    probably start the 10th of December.


    Kurt

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Kurt Roeckx@21:1/5 to Kurt Roeckx on Thu Dec 7 05:30:01 2023
    ------HNPMOZLQ65RJ1T6W2LDZECGVX397CV
    Content-Type: text/plain;
    charset=utf-8
    Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

    Can people make suggestions for the ballot options text?

    Kurt

    On November 30, 2023 12:39:38 AM GMT+03:00, Kurt Roeckx <kurt@roeckx.be> wrote: >Hi,

    I've updated the page at https://www.debian.org/vote/2023/vote_002 which
    the current status.

    We're at the maximum discussion period of 3 weeks, so the vote will
    probably start the 10th of December.


    Kurt


    ------HNPMOZLQ65RJ1T6W2LDZECGVX397CV
    Content-Type: text/html;
    charset=utf-8
    Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

    <html><head></head><body><div dir="auto">Can people make suggestions for the ballot options text?<br><br>Kurt</div><br><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="auto">On November 30, 2023 12:39:38 AM GMT+03:00, Kurt Roeckx &lt;kurt@roeckx.be&gt; wrote:</div>
    <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
    <pre class="k9mail"><div dir="auto">Hi,<br><br>I've updated the page at <a href="https://www.debian.org/vote/2023/vote_002">https://www.debian.org/vote/2023/vote_002</a> which<br>the current status.<br><br>We're at the maximum discussion period of 3
    weeks, so the vote will<br>probably start the 10th of December.<br><br><br>Kurt<br><br></div></pre></blockquote></div></body></html>
    ------HNPMOZLQ65RJ1T6W2LDZECGVX397CV--

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bart Martens@21:1/5 to Kurt Roeckx on Thu Dec 7 16:50:01 2023
    May I suggest for proposal C:
    "The EU should not overrule DFSG 6 and FOSS licenses"


    On Thu, Dec 07, 2023 at 07:19:44AM +0300, Kurt Roeckx wrote:
    Can people make suggestions for the ballot options text?

    Kurt

    On November 30, 2023 12:39:38 AM GMT+03:00, Kurt Roeckx <kurt@roeckx.be> wrote:
    Hi,

    I've updated the page at https://www.debian.org/vote/2023/vote_002 which >the current status.

    We're at the maximum discussion period of 3 weeks, so the vote will >probably start the 10th of December.


    Kurt


    --

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Kurt Roeckx@21:1/5 to Bart Martens on Fri Dec 8 20:50:02 2023
    Since the vote will start in a few hours, I need options for the other 2 options. My best attempts so far:
    A: The CRA and PLD will be detrimental to open source software
    B: The EU should clarify that non-commercial open source is exempted
    C: The EU should not overrule DFSG 6 and FOSS licenses


    Kurt

    On Thu, Dec 07, 2023 at 04:43:09PM +0100, Bart Martens wrote:
    May I suggest for proposal C:
    "The EU should not overrule DFSG 6 and FOSS licenses"


    On Thu, Dec 07, 2023 at 07:19:44AM +0300, Kurt Roeckx wrote:
    Can people make suggestions for the ballot options text?

    Kurt

    On November 30, 2023 12:39:38 AM GMT+03:00, Kurt Roeckx <kurt@roeckx.be> wrote:
    Hi,

    I've updated the page at https://www.debian.org/vote/2023/vote_002 which >the current status.

    We're at the maximum discussion period of 3 weeks, so the vote will >probably start the 10th of December.


    Kurt


    --


    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Kurt Roeckx@21:1/5 to Ilu on Fri Dec 8 21:00:01 2023
    On Fri, Dec 08, 2023 at 08:43:33PM +0100, Ilu wrote:
    The CRA and PLD proposals include regulations, that will be detrimental
    to free and open source software

    We've never had such a long option, and I'm worried this will break for
    some people trying to vote when it gets wrapped to the next line. But it
    might also just be fine. There is at least some code that only checks
    the first few words or something like that.


    Kurt

    Am 08.12.23 um 20:40 schrieb Kurt Roeckx:
    The CRA and PLD will be detrimental to open source software


    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ilu@21:1/5 to All on Fri Dec 8 20:50:02 2023
    The CRA and PLD proposals include regulations, that will be detrimental
    to free and open source software

    Am 08.12.23 um 20:40 schrieb Kurt Roeckx:
    The CRA and PLD will be detrimental to open source software

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Judit Foglszinger@21:1/5 to All on Fri Dec 8 20:55:56 2023
    The CRA and PLD proposals include regulations, that will be detrimental
    to free and open source software

    We've never had such a long option, and I'm worried this will break for
    some people trying to vote when it gets wrapped to the next line. But it might also just be fine. There is at least some code that only checks
    the first few words or something like that.

    regulations in CRA and PLD proposals will be detrimental to FLOSS ?

    -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----

    iQIzBAABCgAdFiEEeh+1J5uI1UvU9CMA9TaqcBEdVxYFAmVzdMwACgkQ9TaqcBEd VxZzew//aU7M4CKzz80Q2ncHDU8idYDnv7bE7kdbv7GW813snXAWht7ze4L6wyP+ Tsdc7n5Ud5uB8wjC6uQSBwg12POlKiE0yI2l88CJe5Y8qc7UQw55GNLsuXgl+ab4 6vcE4/eJrpzte8X+HlrHXjDRdsGI1JV6DQ/1XkUKyzxyT2Ui+DAZdP/Sc2dv3caQ fcgzpx26SJbp5ZWfODD466S/Nnb8CCR40v9yaP6XF5yt8tu02DjX4NOBWlqGG+JF BXXt/OlBSl/FjiqLFYTdpO4nQec+JYk9Oj4hGmu6mGtwGL+EKVaYDKXODqYzqsJg xDg374SMJTaxkRe2Lfb0VsaZN8WyWP9pmbbcJPmvH20glwS3skad/fT5nnD39wxw P8or5IBoYF9pNHnYvHow3f+YVz8dKm9zZvBgCUShXWXrcVrDsdHgiFhHtMxssw6g 5wL/GJ8kEK12843mFS7zURDUku9GD6vfHVF8313yVjvFbmbO0C1G8BHN21ePwxax EJPD8Z24Gq6mNYNx66sS7Vg/XVh6DLU4DQiryyAXsPuvVMmjSZAHZDE0uXSapKeL o0QKtX0f6kM5sq8xiq8VBsNO6qkilY/4x5CIKSD4+DnM51PHS8G3AH7/112AowHh NmK/SD9uCyN+AkT48+iq7s9PIvCUxCDMyBoljm3Xv5pnekVvglM=
    =qLwb
    -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ilu@21:1/5 to All on Fri Dec 8 21:10:01 2023
    Am 08.12.23 um 20:55 schrieb Judit Foglszinger:
    The CRA and PLD proposals include regulations, that will be detrimental
    to free and open source software

    We've never had such a long option, and I'm worried this will break for
    some people trying to vote when it gets wrapped to the next line. But it
    might also just be fine. There is at least some code that only checks
    the first few words or something like that.

    regulations in CRA and PLD proposals will be detrimental to FLOSS ?


    No. It is important that vote A did not say that ALL of CRA and PLD are detrimental. Just certain parts of it. It says explicitely: "While a lot
    of these regulations seem reasonable,..."

    CRA + PLD proposals include regulations, that will be detrimental
    to FOSS

    Without knowing the character limit I cannot produce a solution, but if
    this is still too long you could remove the word "proposals".

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ilu@21:1/5 to All on Fri Dec 8 21:40:01 2023
    Am 08.12.23 um 21:13 schrieb Russ Allbery:
    Ilu <ilulu@gmx.net> writes:

    CRA + PLD proposals include regulations, that will be detrimental
    to FOSS

    How about:

    CRA and PLD proposals include regulations detrimental to FOSS


    This would be real-english-english? ;-) If it has the same meaning, fine
    by me. I've pinged Santiago.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Russ Allbery@21:1/5 to Ilu on Fri Dec 8 21:20:01 2023
    Ilu <ilulu@gmx.net> writes:

    CRA + PLD proposals include regulations, that will be detrimental
    to FOSS

    How about:

    CRA and PLD proposals include regulations detrimental to FOSS

    --
    Russ Allbery (rra@debian.org) <https://www.eyrie.org/~eagle/>

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Lucas Nussbaum@21:1/5 to Kurt Roeckx on Fri Dec 8 22:20:01 2023
    Hi,

    On 08/12/23 at 21:58 +0100, Kurt Roeckx wrote:
    [ ] Choice 1: CRA and PLD proposals include regulations detrimental to FOSS
    [ ] Choice 2: The EU should clarify that non-commercial FOSS is exempted

    "non-commercial FOSS" sounds like CC BY-NC-SA (which is not FOSS). What
    this option is trying to say is that FOSS development outside commercial context should be exempted (or non-commercial FOSS organizations).

    However I cannot find a wording that fits on a single line...

    Lucas

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Santiago Ruano =?iso-8859-1?Q?Rinc=@21:1/5 to All on Fri Dec 8 22:40:01 2023
    El 08/12/23 a las 21:37, Ilu escribió:
    Am 08.12.23 um 21:13 schrieb Russ Allbery:
    Ilu <ilulu@gmx.net> writes:

    CRA + PLD proposals include regulations, that will be detrimental
    to FOSS

    How about:

    CRA and PLD proposals include regulations detrimental to FOSS


    This would be real-english-english? ;-) If it has the same meaning, fine
    by me. I've pinged Santiago.

    I fully trust Russ's English skills :-)

    LGTM.

    Thank you!

    -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----

    iHUEABYIAB0WIQRZVjztY8b+Ty43oH1itBCJKh26HQUCZXOM9AAKCRBitBCJKh26 HemKAQC5DZ9Jmtg8/SntCBfRxftcY1yWU1j5xE/MLxHLY415fwD/ZKenbYKKdwCW eCNbVHhyxo+wxj+KRR7u+coyQboFXQY=
    =xWmv
    -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bart Martens@21:1/5 to Lucas Nussbaum on Sat Dec 9 00:10:01 2023
    On Fri, Dec 08, 2023 at 10:06:45PM +0100, Lucas Nussbaum wrote:
    Hi,

    On 08/12/23 at 21:58 +0100, Kurt Roeckx wrote:
    [ ] Choice 1: CRA and PLD proposals include regulations detrimental to FOSS [ ] Choice 2: The EU should clarify that non-commercial FOSS is exempted

    "non-commercial FOSS" sounds like CC BY-NC-SA (which is not FOSS). What
    this option is trying to say is that FOSS development outside commercial context should be exempted (or non-commercial FOSS organizations).

    However I cannot find a wording that fits on a single line...

    Maybe this?
    [ ] Choice 2: The EU should exempt non-commercial use of FOSS"


    Lucas


    --

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Luca Boccassi@21:1/5 to Bart Martens on Sat Dec 9 00:10:01 2023
    On Fri, 8 Dec 2023 at 23:04, Bart Martens <bartm@debian.org> wrote:

    On Fri, Dec 08, 2023 at 10:06:45PM +0100, Lucas Nussbaum wrote:
    Hi,

    On 08/12/23 at 21:58 +0100, Kurt Roeckx wrote:
    [ ] Choice 1: CRA and PLD proposals include regulations detrimental to FOSS
    [ ] Choice 2: The EU should clarify that non-commercial FOSS is exempted

    "non-commercial FOSS" sounds like CC BY-NC-SA (which is not FOSS). What this option is trying to say is that FOSS development outside commercial context should be exempted (or non-commercial FOSS organizations).

    However I cannot find a wording that fits on a single line...

    Maybe this?
    [ ] Choice 2: The EU should exempt non-commercial use of FOSS"

    It's not just use, development too. Maybe:

    "CRA and PLD proposals should only apply to commercial ventures"

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Russ Allbery@21:1/5 to Ilu on Sat Dec 9 00:30:01 2023
    Ilu <ilulu@gmx.net> writes:
    Am 08.12.23 um 21:13 schrieb Russ Allbery:

    How about:

    CRA and PLD proposals include regulations detrimental to FOSS

    This would be real-english-english? ;-) If it has the same meaning, fine
    by me. I've pinged Santiago.

    Yeah, casually you would normally stick "that would be" or "that are" in between "regulations" and "detrimental", but you can omit it without loss
    of meaning. This wording reads as more formal and a little stuffy, but I
    think people will understand it.

    You more often see this construction in the phrase "actions detrimental to <some organization>" in, say, codes of conduct or laws or whatnot.

    --
    Russ Allbery (rra@debian.org) <https://www.eyrie.org/~eagle/>

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)