On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi
<am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-
people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi
<am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-
people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 20:12:08 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 7:03 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi
<am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-
people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
Mr Garcia wasn't armed. Probably unafraid as well.
But, had he has been afraid and thus carried a gun?
On 3/9/2025 7:03 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi
<am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-
people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
Mr Garcia wasn't armed. Probably unafraid as well.
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>>
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know >each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that youre going to convince folks to be honest!
Roger Merriman
On 10 Mar 2025 08:38:11 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>>>
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know >> each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that youre going to convince folks to be honest!
Roger Merriman
For the last decade or so, having a gun is becoming more popular and
gun laws more lax in the USA. People who fear guns and argue against
them are not convincing anyone.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 20:12:08 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 7:03 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi
<am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-
people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
Mr Garcia wasn't armed. Probably unafraid as well.
Maybe he should have been afraid and have carried a gun.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>>
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that you’re going to convince folks to be honest!
Roger Merriman
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 10 Mar 2025 08:38:11 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>>>>
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know >>> each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that youre going to convince folks to be honest!
Roger Merriman
For the last decade or so, having a gun is becoming more popular and
gun laws more lax in the USA. People who fear guns and argue against
them are not convincing anyone.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
The number of people owning or living in a house with at least one gun,
seems to be statistically flat, and apparently hasn’t changed since the 70’s. Seems to be just shy of 50% though the two groups would overlap so the number of households without a gun is unlikely to 50% but lower.
I could well believe that there are more guns about, ie people owning multiple guns, as well does seem to be a hobby/thing.
Gun laws are state not country aren’t they? So presumably differs hugely. Ie gun laws and use would differ greatly from states with big cities to market towns with farmers and what not.
Roger Merriman
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 10 Mar 2025 08:38:11 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>>>>
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know >>> each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that you?re going to convince folks to be honest!
Roger Merriman
For the last decade or so, having a gun is becoming more popular and
gun laws more lax in the USA. People who fear guns and argue against
them are not convincing anyone.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
The number of people owning or living in a house with at least one gun,
seems to be statistically flat, and apparently hasnt changed since the
70s. Seems to be just shy of 50% though the two groups would overlap so
the number of households without a gun is unlikely to 50% but lower.
I could well believe that there are more guns about, ie people owning >multiple guns, as well does seem to be a hobby/thing.
Gun laws are state not country arent they? So presumably differs hugely.
Ie gun laws and use would differ greatly from states with big cities to >market towns with farmers and what not.
Roger Merriman
On 3/10/2025 6:28 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 10 Mar 2025 08:38:11 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>>>>>
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know >>>> each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that youre going to convince folks to be honest!
Roger Merriman
For the last decade or so, having a gun is becoming more popular and
gun laws more lax in the USA. People who fear guns and argue against
them are not convincing anyone.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
The number of people owning or living in a house with at least one gun,
seems to be statistically flat, and apparently hasn’t changed since the
70’s. Seems to be just shy of 50% though the two groups would overlap so >> the number of households without a gun is unlikely to 50% but lower.
I could well believe that there are more guns about, ie people owning
multiple guns, as well does seem to be a hobby/thing.
Gun laws are state not country aren’t they? So presumably differs hugely. >> Ie gun laws and use would differ greatly from states with big cities to
market towns with farmers and what not.
Roger Merriman
There are notable trends. With good reason:
https://www.essence.com/news/black-women-gun-ownership-rise/
https://nationalcenter.org/ncppr/2025/03/06/craig-deluz-the-evolving-presence-of-blacks-in-the-firearms-industry/
excerpt:
“Most gun violence is committed with illegal weapons, so
increasing restrictions on legal owners only disarms those
who abide by the law.”
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:28 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 10 Mar 2025 08:38:11 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>>>>>>
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know
each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that youre going to convince folks to be honest!
Roger Merriman
For the last decade or so, having a gun is becoming more popular and
gun laws more lax in the USA. People who fear guns and argue against
them are not convincing anyone.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
The number of people owning or living in a house with at least one gun,
seems to be statistically flat, and apparently hasn’t changed since the >>> 70’s. Seems to be just shy of 50% though the two groups would overlap so >>> the number of households without a gun is unlikely to 50% but lower.
I could well believe that there are more guns about, ie people owning
multiple guns, as well does seem to be a hobby/thing.
Gun laws are state not country aren’t they? So presumably differs hugely. >>> Ie gun laws and use would differ greatly from states with big cities to
market towns with farmers and what not.
Roger Merriman
There are notable trends. With good reason:
https://www.essence.com/news/black-women-gun-ownership-rise/
https://nationalcenter.org/ncppr/2025/03/06/craig-deluz-the-evolving-presence-of-blacks-in-the-firearms-industry/
excerpt:
“Most gun violence is committed with illegal weapons, so
increasing restrictions on legal owners only disarms those
who abide by the law.”
Those are even without clicking the links clearly opinion pieces which isn’t unexpected for US than something without the politics and dry facts or statistics.
Roger Merriman
On 3/10/2025 9:53 AM, AMuzi wrote:
Valid opinions are based in supporting data.
Wait... I thought I read here that everything is subjective, or
something like that!
On 3/10/2025 4:38 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>>>
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know >> each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that youre going to convince folks to be honest!
Of course I won't convince a person whose most fundamental belief is "I
gotta carry a gun to be safe." Any time they hear of a similar >one-in-a-million incident occurring thousands of miles away, they take
it as "proof" that they _must_ carry their macho toy to be safe. But
they simultaneously pretend there's no fear involved, none at all!
Because admitting that fear contradicts their brave macho self image.
Changing their mind would require a Road to Damascus moment, maybe
something like accidentally shooting their best friend dead.
They're
absolutely impervious to data or logic.
On my ride today, I will not carry a gun nor be afraid. How's that for
macho? ;-)
On 3/10/2025 8:37 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:28 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 10 Mar 2025 08:38:11 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know
each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that youre going to convince folks to be honest!
Roger Merriman
For the last decade or so, having a gun is becoming more popular and >>>>> gun laws more lax in the USA. People who fear guns and argue against >>>>> them are not convincing anyone.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
The number of people owning or living in a house with at least one gun, >>>> seems to be statistically flat, and apparently hasn’t changed since the >>>> 70’s. Seems to be just shy of 50% though the two groups would overlap so >>>> the number of households without a gun is unlikely to 50% but lower.
I could well believe that there are more guns about, ie people owning
multiple guns, as well does seem to be a hobby/thing.
Gun laws are state not country aren’t they? So presumably differs hugely.
Ie gun laws and use would differ greatly from states with big cities to >>>> market towns with farmers and what not.
Roger Merriman
There are notable trends. With good reason:
https://www.essence.com/news/black-women-gun-ownership-rise/
https://nationalcenter.org/ncppr/2025/03/06/craig-deluz-the-evolving-presence-of-blacks-in-the-firearms-industry/
excerpt:
“Most gun violence is committed with illegal weapons, so
increasing restrictions on legal owners only disarms those
who abide by the law.”
Those are even without clicking the links clearly opinion pieces which
isn’t unexpected for US than something without the politics and dry facts >> or statistics.
Roger Merriman
Oddly, anti-firearms ownership organizations publish the
same data sets:
https://www.ajpmonline.org/article/S0749-3797(24)00226-5/fulltext
Everyone has opinions. Which is good.
Valid opinions are based in supporting data.
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 11:21:24 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 4:38 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>>>>
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know >>> each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that youre going to convince folks to be honest!
Of course I won't convince a person whose most fundamental belief is "I >>gotta carry a gun to be safe." Any time they hear of a similar >>one-in-a-million incident occurring thousands of miles away, they take
it as "proof" that they _must_ carry their macho toy to be safe. But
they simultaneously pretend there's no fear involved, none at all!
Like I said, everyone is afraid of something. You're afraid of puppy
dogs.
Because admitting that fear contradicts their brave macho self image.
I'm afraid of many things. That's why I carry several links of chain,
in addition to spare tubes, a pump, etc. I've never had to use those
links, but I got 'em in case I do. Better to have something you don't
need than not having something you need.
Changing their mind would require a Road to Damascus moment, maybe >>something like accidentally shooting their best friend dead.
Oh my, be afraid, be very afraid of that...
They're
absolutely impervious to data or logic.
Why would I shoot my best friend? What's the logic of that?
On my ride today, I will not carry a gun nor be afraid. How's that for >>macho? ;-)
Of course you won't. You're afraid of guns and riding with others
where you know you'll be safe takes care of that fear for you.
Well, safety in numbers works pretty well for Wildebeast and Zebra,
but Grizzle Bears prefer to go it alone, probably because they can
take care of themselves.
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 8:37 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:28 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 10 Mar 2025 08:38:11 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>>
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know
each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that you?re going to convince folks to be honest!
Roger Merriman
For the last decade or so, having a gun is becoming more popular and >>>>>> gun laws more lax in the USA. People who fear guns and argue against >>>>>> them are not convincing anyone.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
The number of people owning or living in a house with at least one gun, >>>>> seems to be statistically flat, and apparently hasnt changed since the >>>>> 70s. Seems to be just shy of 50% though the two groups would overlap so >>>>> the number of households without a gun is unlikely to 50% but lower. >>>>>
I could well believe that there are more guns about, ie people owning >>>>> multiple guns, as well does seem to be a hobby/thing.
Gun laws are state not country arent they? So presumably differs hugely. >>>>> Ie gun laws and use would differ greatly from states with big cities to >>>>> market towns with farmers and what not.
Roger Merriman
There are notable trends. With good reason:
https://www.essence.com/news/black-women-gun-ownership-rise/
https://nationalcenter.org/ncppr/2025/03/06/craig-deluz-the-evolving-presence-of-blacks-in-the-firearms-industry/
excerpt:
Most gun violence is committed with illegal weapons, so
increasing restrictions on legal owners only disarms those
who abide by the law.
Those are even without clicking the links clearly opinion pieces which
isnt unexpected for US than something without the politics and dry facts >>> or statistics.
Roger Merriman
Oddly, anti-firearms ownership organizations publish the
same data sets:
https://www.ajpmonline.org/article/S0749-3797(24)00226-5/fulltext
Everyone has opinions. Which is good.
Valid opinions are based in supporting data.
Id suggest neither is particularly useful in terms of accuracy and equally >unlikely to be cut the difference between the two sides as you were.
Some times particularly the loud click bate voices and both sides can be >wholly wrong and so on.
Roger Merriman
On 3/10/2025 9:53 AM, AMuzi wrote:
Valid opinions are based in supporting data.
Wait... I thought I read here that everything is subjective,
or something like that!
On 3/10/2025 4:38 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi
<am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-
people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-
scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is
with folks who know
each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that you’re going to convince folks to be honest!
Of course I won't convince a person whose most fundamental
belief is "I gotta carry a gun to be safe." Any time they
hear of a similar one-in-a-million incident occurring
thousands of miles away, they take it as "proof" that they
_must_ carry their macho toy to be safe. But they
simultaneously pretend there's no fear involved, none at
all! Because admitting that fear contradicts their brave
macho self image.
Changing their mind would require a Road to Damascus moment,
maybe something like accidentally shooting their best friend
dead. They're absolutely impervious to data or logic.
On my ride today, I will not carry a gun nor be afraid.
How's that for macho? ;-)
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 11:21:24 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 4:38 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>>>>
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know >>> each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that you’re going to convince folks to be honest!
Of course I won't convince a person whose most fundamental belief is "I
gotta carry a gun to be safe." Any time they hear of a similar
one-in-a-million incident occurring thousands of miles away, they take
it as "proof" that they _must_ carry their macho toy to be safe. But
they simultaneously pretend there's no fear involved, none at all!
Like I said, everyone is afraid of something. You're afraid of puppy
dogs.
Because admitting that fear contradicts their brave macho self image.
I'm afraid of many things. That's why I carry several links of chain,
in addition to spare tubes, a pump, etc. I've never had to use those
links, but I got 'em in case I do. Better to have something you don't
need than not having something you need.
Changing their mind would require a Road to Damascus moment, maybe
something like accidentally shooting their best friend dead.
Oh my, be afraid, be very afraid of that...
They're
absolutely impervious to data or logic.
Why would I shoot my best friend? What's the logic of that?
On my ride today, I will not carry a gun nor be afraid. How's that for
macho? ;-)
Of course you won't. You're afraid of guns and riding with others
where you know you'll be safe takes care of that fear for you.
Well, safety in numbers works pretty well for Wildebeast and Zebra,
but Grizzle Bears prefer to go it alone, probably because they can
take care of themselves.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 8:37 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:28 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 10 Mar 2025 08:38:11 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>>
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know
each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that youre going to convince folks to be honest!
Roger Merriman
For the last decade or so, having a gun is becoming more popular and >>>>>> gun laws more lax in the USA. People who fear guns and argue against >>>>>> them are not convincing anyone.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
The number of people owning or living in a house with at least one gun, >>>>> seems to be statistically flat, and apparently hasn’t changed since the >>>>> 70’s. Seems to be just shy of 50% though the two groups would overlap so
the number of households without a gun is unlikely to 50% but lower. >>>>>
I could well believe that there are more guns about, ie people owning >>>>> multiple guns, as well does seem to be a hobby/thing.
Gun laws are state not country aren’t they? So presumably differs hugely.
Ie gun laws and use would differ greatly from states with big cities to >>>>> market towns with farmers and what not.
Roger Merriman
There are notable trends. With good reason:
https://www.essence.com/news/black-women-gun-ownership-rise/
https://nationalcenter.org/ncppr/2025/03/06/craig-deluz-the-evolving-presence-of-blacks-in-the-firearms-industry/
excerpt:
“Most gun violence is committed with illegal weapons, so
increasing restrictions on legal owners only disarms those
who abide by the law.”
Those are even without clicking the links clearly opinion pieces which
isn’t unexpected for US than something without the politics and dry facts >>> or statistics.
Roger Merriman
Oddly, anti-firearms ownership organizations publish the
same data sets:
https://www.ajpmonline.org/article/S0749-3797(24)00226-5/fulltext
Everyone has opinions. Which is good.
Valid opinions are based in supporting data.
I’d suggest neither is particularly useful in terms of accuracy and equally unlikely to be cut the difference between the two sides as you were.
Some times particularly the loud click bate voices and both sides can be wholly wrong and so on.
Roger Merriman
On 3/10/2025 10:21 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 4:38 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi
<am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-
people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-
scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is
with folks who know
each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that youre going to convince folks to be honest!
Of course I won't convince a person whose most fundamental
belief is "I gotta carry a gun to be safe." Any time they
hear of a similar one-in-a-million incident occurring
thousands of miles away, they take it as "proof" that they
_must_ carry their macho toy to be safe. But they
simultaneously pretend there's no fear involved, none at
all! Because admitting that fear contradicts their brave
macho self image.
Changing their mind would require a Road to Damascus moment,
maybe something like accidentally shooting their best friend
dead. They're absolutely impervious to data or logic.
On my ride today, I will not carry a gun nor be afraid.
How's that for macho? ;-)
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer.
There were four murders at her neighborhood (Rogers Park)
train station in 2024.
More in the neighborhood: >https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/medical-examiner-confirms-rogers-park-hate-crime-gunman-died-by-suicide.html
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/02/quick-work-by-cops-leads-to-charges-in-double-shooting-that-left-1-dead-in-rogers-park.html
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/02/gunmen-rob-loyola-student-carjack-driver-nearby.html
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/02/bag-of-cash-gun-found-at-rogers-park-shooting-scene-1-dead-1-critical.html
Red Line train of late: >https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/15-year-old-boy-was-part-of-robbery-crew-that-mugged-3-on-the-red-line-police.html
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/group-beat-and-robbed-senior-citizen-on-the-red-line-police-say-in-new-seeking-to-identify-bulletin.html
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/he-attacked-a-74-year-old-with-wire-cutters-at-fullerton-cta-station-prosecutors-say.html
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/river-north-robber-was-wearing-an-electronic-monitoring-bracelet-for-another-attempted-robbery-officials-say.html
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/man-charged-with-north-side-train-robbery-after-cop-recognizes-him-in-wanted-poster.html
She does not carry and will not (which is good. she is
psychologically ill-suited to use of firearms).
Then again, she says being run down by a car on icy streets
is less likely than being mugged on the train.
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 13:38:03 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:21 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 4:38 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi
<am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-
people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-
scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is
with folks who know
each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that you’re going to convince folks to be honest!
Of course I won't convince a person whose most fundamental
belief is "I gotta carry a gun to be safe." Any time they
hear of a similar one-in-a-million incident occurring
thousands of miles away, they take it as "proof" that they
_must_ carry their macho toy to be safe. But they
simultaneously pretend there's no fear involved, none at
all! Because admitting that fear contradicts their brave
macho self image.
Changing their mind would require a Road to Damascus moment,
maybe something like accidentally shooting their best friend
dead. They're absolutely impervious to data or logic.
On my ride today, I will not carry a gun nor be afraid.
How's that for macho? ;-)
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer.
There were four murders at her neighborhood (Rogers Park)
train station in 2024.
More in the neighborhood:
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/medical-examiner-confirms-rogers-park-hate-crime-gunman-died-by-suicide.html
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/02/quick-work-by-cops-leads-to-charges-in-double-shooting-that-left-1-dead-in-rogers-park.html
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/02/gunmen-rob-loyola-student-carjack-driver-nearby.html
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/02/bag-of-cash-gun-found-at-rogers-park-shooting-scene-1-dead-1-critical.html
Red Line train of late:
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/15-year-old-boy-was-part-of-robbery-crew-that-mugged-3-on-the-red-line-police.html
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/group-beat-and-robbed-senior-citizen-on-the-red-line-police-say-in-new-seeking-to-identify-bulletin.html
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/he-attacked-a-74-year-old-with-wire-cutters-at-fullerton-cta-station-prosecutors-say.html
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/river-north-robber-was-wearing-an-electronic-monitoring-bracelet-for-another-attempted-robbery-officials-say.html
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/man-charged-with-north-side-train-robbery-after-cop-recognizes-him-in-wanted-poster.html
She does not carry and will not (which is good. she is
psychologically ill-suited to use of firearms).
Then again, she says being run down by a car on icy streets
is less likely than being mugged on the train.
I remember fearlessly wandering the streets of Chicago near Old Town
and Chicago Underground until late in the evening. That was in the
1960s. People tell me that wasn't even safe back then, but I never had
any trouble. I did have a couple of guns back then, but I never gave
any thought to taking them to Chicaago.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
On 3/10/2025 1:57 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 13:38:03 -0500, AMuzi
<am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:21 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 4:38 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi
<am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-
people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-
scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is
with folks who know
each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that you’re going to convince folks to be
honest!
Of course I won't convince a person whose most fundamental
belief is "I gotta carry a gun to be safe." Any time they
hear of a similar one-in-a-million incident occurring
thousands of miles away, they take it as "proof" that they
_must_ carry their macho toy to be safe. But they
simultaneously pretend there's no fear involved, none at
all! Because admitting that fear contradicts their brave
macho self image.
Changing their mind would require a Road to Damascus
moment,
maybe something like accidentally shooting their best
friend
dead. They're absolutely impervious to data or logic.
On my ride today, I will not carry a gun nor be afraid.
How's that for macho? ;-)
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer.
There were four murders at her neighborhood (Rogers Park)
train station in 2024.
More in the neighborhood:
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/medical-examiner-confirms-
rogers-park-hate-crime-gunman-died-by-suicide.html
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/02/quick-work-by-cops-leads-
to-charges-in-double-shooting-that-left-1-dead-in-rogers-
park.html
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/02/gunmen-rob-loyola-student-
carjack-driver-nearby.html
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/02/bag-of-cash-gun-found-at-
rogers-park-shooting-scene-1-dead-1-critical.html
Red Line train of late:
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/15-year-old-boy-was-part-
of-robbery-crew-that-mugged-3-on-the-red-line-police.html
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/group-beat-and-robbed-
senior-citizen-on-the-red-line-police-say-in-new-seeking-
to-identify-bulletin.html
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/he-attacked-a-74-year-old-
with-wire-cutters-at-fullerton-cta-station-prosecutors-
say.html
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/river-north-robber-was-
wearing-an-electronic-monitoring-bracelet-for-another-
attempted-robbery-officials-say.html
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/man-charged-with-north-
side-train-robbery-after-cop-recognizes-him-in-wanted-
poster.html
She does not carry and will not (which is good. she is
psychologically ill-suited to use of firearms).
Then again, she says being run down by a car on icy streets
is less likely than being mugged on the train.
I remember fearlessly wandering the streets of Chicago
near Old Town
and Chicago Underground until late in the evening. That
was in the
1960s. People tell me that wasn't even safe back then, but
I never had
any trouble. I did have a couple of guns back then, but I
never gave
any thought to taking them to Chicaago.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
In Old Town in the 1960s you're probably correct in not
carrying.
In North Lawndale in the 1980s/early 1990s not being armed
was just stupid. I always carried there.
On 3/10/2025 11:42 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 8:37 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:28 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 10 Mar 2025 08:38:11 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>>>
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know
each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that youre going to convince folks to be honest! >>>>>>>>
Roger Merriman
For the last decade or so, having a gun is becoming more popular and >>>>>>> gun laws more lax in the USA. People who fear guns and argue against >>>>>>> them are not convincing anyone.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
The number of people owning or living in a house with at least one gun, >>>>>> seems to be statistically flat, and apparently hasn’t changed since the
70’s. Seems to be just shy of 50% though the two groups would overlap so
the number of households without a gun is unlikely to 50% but lower. >>>>>>
I could well believe that there are more guns about, ie people owning >>>>>> multiple guns, as well does seem to be a hobby/thing.
Gun laws are state not country aren’t they? So presumably differs hugely.
Ie gun laws and use would differ greatly from states with big cities to >>>>>> market towns with farmers and what not.
Roger Merriman
There are notable trends. With good reason:
https://www.essence.com/news/black-women-gun-ownership-rise/
https://nationalcenter.org/ncppr/2025/03/06/craig-deluz-the-evolving-presence-of-blacks-in-the-firearms-industry/
excerpt:
“Most gun violence is committed with illegal weapons, so
increasing restrictions on legal owners only disarms those
who abide by the law.”
Those are even without clicking the links clearly opinion pieces which >>>> isn’t unexpected for US than something without the politics and dry facts
or statistics.
Roger Merriman
Oddly, anti-firearms ownership organizations publish the
same data sets:
https://www.ajpmonline.org/article/S0749-3797(24)00226-5/fulltext
Everyone has opinions. Which is good.
Valid opinions are based in supporting data.
I’d suggest neither is particularly useful in terms of accuracy and equally
unlikely to be cut the difference between the two sides as you were.
Some times particularly the loud click bate voices and both sides can be
wholly wrong and so on.
Roger Merriman
??? WTF?
Here in USA, firearm ownership is increasing and increasing
fastest among women and minorities. Multiple data sources
confirm that, and have for many years (although policy
conclusions do vary quite a bit). Some applaud, some
bemoan, some harangue but that is the actual trend in USA
So you, who are not immersed in USA society, discount the
obvious and clearly reported facts, accepted across the
political spectrum, about USA trends and frequency? Why?
I have carried a pocket knife since I was a child. Never
sliced or stabbed anyone but yet I carry it anyway.
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 13:42:36 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
I have carried a pocket knife since I was a child. Never
sliced or stabbed anyone but yet I carry it anyway.
Likewise. I began carrying a pocket knife in about 1967, when I
turned 18 and began driving my parents 1960 Ford Falcon 200 CID. The
car had so many things wrong with it that it was necessary to carry a
pocket toolbox to perform repairs. I rarely bother to sharpen my
knives because I usually destroy them before the blade becomes dull.
My current pocket knife is mostly used as a box and electrical tape
cutter (serrated edge).
<https://photos.app.goo.gl/WXWh3SY6tdSTN23K8>
The smaller knife is my EDC (every day carry). The larger knife is
for when I misplace the smaller knife. The Leatherman Wave is for
when I'm working in the woods.
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
On 3/10/2025 11:26 AM, floriduh dumbass wrote:
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 11:21:24 -0400, Frank Krygowski
Of course I won't convince a person whose most fundamental belief is "I
gotta carry a gun to be safe." Any time they hear of a similar
one-in-a-million incident occurring thousands of miles away, they take
it as "proof" that they _must_ carry their macho toy to be safe. But
they simultaneously pretend there's no fear involved, none at all!
Like I said, everyone is afraid of something. You're afraid of puppy
dogs.
Because admitting that fear contradicts their brave macho self image.
I'm afraid of many things. That's why I carry several links of chain,
in addition to spare tubes, a pump, etc. I've never had to use those
links, but I got 'em in case I do. Better to have something you don't
need than not having something you need.
Changing their mind would require a Road to Damascus moment, maybe
something like accidentally shooting their best friend dead.
Oh my, be afraid, be very afraid of that...
They're
absolutely impervious to data or logic.
Why would I shoot my best friend? What's the logic of that?
On my ride today, I will not carry a gun nor be afraid. How's that for
macho? ;-)
Of course you won't. You're afraid of guns and riding with others
where you know you'll be safe takes care of that fear for you.
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 13:42:36 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
I have carried a pocket knife since I was a child. Never
sliced or stabbed anyone but yet I carry it anyway.
Likewise. I began carrying a pocket knife in about 1967, when I
turned 18 and began driving my parents 1960 Ford Falcon 200 CID. The
car had so many things wrong with it that it was necessary to carry a
pocket toolbox to perform repairs. I rarely bother to sharpen my
knives because I usually destroy them before the blade becomes dull.
My current pocket knife is mostly used as a box and electrical tape
cutter (serrated edge).
<https://photos.app.goo.gl/WXWh3SY6tdSTN23K8>
The smaller knife is my EDC (every day carry). The larger knife is
for when I misplace the smaller knife. The Leatherman Wave is for
when I'm working in the woods.
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 13:42:36 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
I have carried a pocket knife since I was a child. Never
sliced or stabbed anyone but yet I carry it anyway.
Likewise. I began carrying a pocket knife in about 1967, when I
turned 18 and began driving my parents 1960 Ford Falcon 200 CID. The
car had so many things wrong with it that it was necessary to carry a
pocket toolbox to perform repairs. I rarely bother to sharpen my
knives because I usually destroy them before the blade becomes dull.
My current pocket knife is mostly used as a box and electrical tape
cutter (serrated edge).
<https://photos.app.goo.gl/WXWh3SY6tdSTN23K8>
The smaller knife is my EDC (every day carry). The larger knife is
for when I misplace the smaller knife. The Leatherman Wave is for
when I'm working in the woods.
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own behavior based on
their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are horribly
afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees, graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in inclement or
bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet found a >horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in suburban Florida, near our >timid tricycle rider.
On 3/10/2025 2:39 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:23 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:53 AM, AMuzi wrote:
Valid opinions are based in supporting data.
Wait... I thought I read here that everything is subjective, or
something like that!
Nope, not from me.
Quoting your timid ally: "most everything *IS* subjective for people who >don't believe everything they're told."
A person who accepted that would have to say that your data on increased
gun ownership is actually true only for some people. And conversely, it
would actually be simultaneously false for other people.
And I don't think he's so sophisticated as to try to macroscopically
apply Schroedinger's Cat - which would be silly enough.
Things which have actually happened can actually recur.
Sure. Applying a force to a mass can cause it to accelerate, time after
time. Applying heat to a mass of metal can cause it to increase in >temperature, and that can certainly recur.
But your "intellectual" buddy would say "No, correlation does not imply >causation" and "most everything is subjective." It's his version of
"Ommmmm, nothing can be known, all is mystery."
Please have him wrap his bare hand around a frame joint you've just
finished brazing.
On 3/10/2025 2:42 PM, AMuzi wrote:
Same here. I also carry a comb and a handkerchief. But it's pretty silly
I have carried a pocket knife since I was a child. Never sliced or
stabbed anyone but yet I carry it anyway.
to pretend that the motivation for those things is the same as the
motivation for carrying a gun.
The handkerchief is handy for blowing my nose or mopping my brow. The >pocketknife is handy for opening packages, cutting string, sharpening >pencils, etc. The comb is for combing my hair. I use all three every day.
The gun is handy for killing, or threatening to kill someone, because
you're afraid of them.
AFAICT only one person here is that fearful, and
AFAICT that person has never once used the gun for its intended purpose.
I'm reminded of the joke about the guy who walked around snapping his
fingers all the time.
"Why do you keep snapping your fingers??"
"It keeps the elephants away."
"That's nuts. There are no elephants anywhere around here!"
"See? It works!!"
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 19:21:53 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own behavior based on
their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are horribly
afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees, graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying lethal weaponry. >>
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in inclement or
bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet found a
horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in suburban Florida, near our
timid tricycle rider.
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms - you even bragged about your bravery, ""I short one a few times". However I can find no record of
a firearm leaping down from the gun rack and rushing out the door to
shoot someone.
On 3/10/2025 8:27 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
For many years, I've carried a gun in a
shoulder holster when I've been driving long distance, even in states
when it wasn't legal to do so. Standing beside the car or truck while
pumping gas at 0200 seemed to warrant it.
Damn. What a timid, fearful man!
On 3/10/2025 8:11 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own behavior based
on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are horribly
afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees, graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying lethal
weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in inclement
or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet found a
horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in suburban Florida, near
our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
Which does not mean it's even remotely likely on the bike path where Mr. >Tricycle Rider rides. It was a one in a million event, thousands of
miles away.
His fear is as unrealistic as fear of dying from a spider bite. It's
almost as unrealistic as fear of walking past a graveyard. It's a
phobia, and his quasi-macho defense strategy is even less admirable than >clutching a teddy bear.
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 22:56:08 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 8:11 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own behavior based
on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are horribly
afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees, graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying lethal
weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in inclement
or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet found a
horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in suburban Florida, near
our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
Which does not mean it's even remotely likely on the bike path where Mr. >>Tricycle Rider rides. It was a one in a million event, thousands of
miles away.
His fear is as unrealistic as fear of dying from a spider bite. It's
almost as unrealistic as fear of walking past a graveyard. It's a
phobia, and his quasi-macho defense strategy is even less admirable than >>clutching a teddy bear.
And you know that how? Known the guy for years, your wife and his wife
are friends?
Or your sole knowledge comes from a post on the Internet?
My guess is the latter which make you a fool.
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 12:26:30 -0400, Catrike Ryder
<Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 11:21:24 -0400, Frank Krygowski >><frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 4:38 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>>>>>
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know >>>> each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that youre going to convince folks to be honest!
Of course I won't convince a person whose most fundamental belief is "I >>>gotta carry a gun to be safe." Any time they hear of a similar >>>one-in-a-million incident occurring thousands of miles away, they take
it as "proof" that they _must_ carry their macho toy to be safe. But
they simultaneously pretend there's no fear involved, none at all!
Like I said, everyone is afraid of something. You're afraid of puppy
dogs.
Because admitting that fear contradicts their brave macho self image.
I'm afraid of many things. That's why I carry several links of chain,
in addition to spare tubes, a pump, etc. I've never had to use those
links, but I got 'em in case I do. Better to have something you don't
need than not having something you need.
Changing their mind would require a Road to Damascus moment, maybe >>>something like accidentally shooting their best friend dead.
Oh my, be afraid, be very afraid of that...
They're
absolutely impervious to data or logic.
Why would I shoot my best friend? What's the logic of that?
On my ride today, I will not carry a gun nor be afraid. How's that for >>>macho? ;-)
Of course you won't. You're afraid of guns and riding with others
where you know you'll be safe takes care of that fear for you.
Well, safety in numbers works pretty well for Wildebeast and Zebra,
but Grizzle Bears prefer to go it alone, probably because they can
take care of themselves.
But.. but..but.. carrying a gun is legal in many places so why is
doing something that is legal a sin?
Or is this simply a matter of "you must do as I recommend or you are
wrong".
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish for firearms, and
the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for paranoia so severe
as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to do ordinary things like
ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill a gas tank, etc.
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias. Not this one.
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist. One classmate of mine
in an adult education class brought his handgun to a class picnic in the >country. Nice guy, but that was crazy paranoia. Another guy, less
admirable in general, bragged to me about carrying his handgun into a
folk music concert we attended. Absolute stupidity, and crazy paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that he used a special
stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly. Maybe his physical >shortcomings triggered feelings of great vulnerability, as with Mr.
Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off the charts crazy - as
is Mr. Tricycle's.
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going out on limb >> but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion,
shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
On 3/10/2025 11:26 AM, floriduh dumbass wrote:
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 11:21:24 -0400, Frank Krygowski
Of course I won't convince a person whose most fundamental belief is "I >>>> gotta carry a gun to be safe." Any time they hear of a similar
one-in-a-million incident occurring thousands of miles away, they take >>>> it as "proof" that they _must_ carry their macho toy to be safe. But
they simultaneously pretend there's no fear involved, none at all!
Like I said, everyone is afraid of something. You're afraid of puppy
dogs.
Assumes facts not in evidence
Because admitting that fear contradicts their brave macho self image.
I'm afraid of many things. That's why I carry several links of chain,
in addition to spare tubes, a pump, etc. I've never had to use those
links, but I got 'em in case I do. Better to have something you don't
need than not having something you need.
Changing their mind would require a Road to Damascus moment, maybe
something like accidentally shooting their best friend dead.
Oh my, be afraid, be very afraid of that...
They're
absolutely impervious to data or logic.
Why would I shoot my best friend? What's the logic of that?
WHOOSH!
On my ride today, I will not carry a gun nor be afraid. How's that for >>>> macho? ;-)
Of course you won't. You're afraid of guns and riding with others
where you know you'll be safe takes care of that fear for you.
More tommy-lies...yes, you're not tommy, but pretty fucking close with
making up things about people for the simple reason that your butthurt
and jealous.
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
Just because it can happen doesn?t mean it will happen, going out on limb >>> but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without >>> carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him? >>>
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion,
shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
Im assuming this was the Vietnam war or similar which is a kinda difficult >risk case to put it mildly!
And yes there are places where having a gun on you seems a wise decision, >riding your bike even in America doesnt seems likely hence the absence of >bike specific kit to do so.
Roger Merriman
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without >carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him?
Roger Merriman
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish for
firearms, and the effect it has on society. And I exhibit
scorn for paranoia so severe as to cause a person to
_require_ a firearm to do ordinary things like ride a quiet
bike path, drive a car, fill a gas tank, etc.
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias. Not
this one.
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist. One
classmate of mine in an adult education class brought his
handgun to a class picnic in the country. Nice guy, but that
was crazy paranoia. Another guy, less admirable in general,
bragged to me about carrying his handgun into a folk music
concert we attended. Absolute stupidity, and crazy paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that he used
a special stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly.
Maybe his physical shortcomings triggered feelings of great
vulnerability, as with Mr. Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk
assessment was off the charts crazy - as is Mr. Tricycle's.
On 3/10/2025 8:11 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who
are horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work
in inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not
yet found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike
path.
Which does not mean it's even remotely likely on the bike
path where Mr. Tricycle Rider rides. It was a one in a
million event, thousands of miles away.
His fear is as unrealistic as fear of dying from a spider
bite. It's almost as unrealistic as fear of walking past a
graveyard. It's a phobia, and his quasi-macho defense
strategy is even less admirable than clutching a teddy bear.
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 13:42:36 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 11:26 AM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 11:21:24 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 4:38 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>>>>>>
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know
each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that you’re going to convince folks to be honest!
Of course I won't convince a person whose most fundamental belief is "I >>>> gotta carry a gun to be safe." Any time they hear of a similar
one-in-a-million incident occurring thousands of miles away, they take >>>> it as "proof" that they _must_ carry their macho toy to be safe. But
they simultaneously pretend there's no fear involved, none at all!
Like I said, everyone is afraid of something. You're afraid of puppy
dogs.
Because admitting that fear contradicts their brave macho self image.
I'm afraid of many things. That's why I carry several links of chain,
in addition to spare tubes, a pump, etc. I've never had to use those
links, but I got 'em in case I do. Better to have something you don't
need than not having something you need.
Changing their mind would require a Road to Damascus moment, maybe
something like accidentally shooting their best friend dead.
Oh my, be afraid, be very afraid of that...
They're
absolutely impervious to data or logic.
Why would I shoot my best friend? What's the logic of that?
On my ride today, I will not carry a gun nor be afraid. How's that for >>>> macho? ;-)
Of course you won't. You're afraid of guns and riding with others
where you know you'll be safe takes care of that fear for you.
Well, safety in numbers works pretty well for Wildebeast and Zebra,
but Grizzle Bears prefer to go it alone, probably because they can
take care of themselves.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
+1
I have carried a pocket knife since I was a child. Never
sliced or stabbed anyone but yet I carry it anyway.
When I was about 5 years old my grandfather gave me a pocket knife,-
"All boys should have a knife", with which I promptly cut myself. As I
was a bit away from the house I walked back and got there with a shoe
full of blood. My Mother (it was her father) got pretty upset but
Grandfather was really "The lord of the Manor" and he said, "Of course
he cut himself, lf boys didn't cut themselves . how would they learn
to be careful?"
I've still got the scar and I still remember to be careful with sharp
things :-)
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
Just because it can happen doesn’t mean it will happen, going out on limb but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him?
Roger Merriman
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 08:53:40 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 8:37 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:28 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 10 Mar 2025 08:38:11 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>>
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know
each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that you?re going to convince folks to be honest!
Roger Merriman
For the last decade or so, having a gun is becoming more popular and >>>>>> gun laws more lax in the USA. People who fear guns and argue against >>>>>> them are not convincing anyone.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
The number of people owning or living in a house with at least one gun, >>>>> seems to be statistically flat, and apparently hasn’t changed since the >>>>> 70’s. Seems to be just shy of 50% though the two groups would overlap so
the number of households without a gun is unlikely to 50% but lower. >>>>>
I could well believe that there are more guns about, ie people owning >>>>> multiple guns, as well does seem to be a hobby/thing.
Gun laws are state not country aren’t they? So presumably differs hugely.
Ie gun laws and use would differ greatly from states with big cities to >>>>> market towns with farmers and what not.
Roger Merriman
There are notable trends. With good reason:
https://www.essence.com/news/black-women-gun-ownership-rise/
https://nationalcenter.org/ncppr/2025/03/06/craig-deluz-the-evolving-presence-of-blacks-in-the-firearms-industry/
excerpt:
“Most gun violence is committed with illegal weapons, so
increasing restrictions on legal owners only disarms those
who abide by the law.”
Those are even without clicking the links clearly opinion pieces which
isn’t unexpected for US than something without the politics and dry facts >>> or statistics.
Roger Merriman
Oddly, anti-firearms ownership organizations publish the
same data sets:
https://www.ajpmonline.org/article/S0749-3797(24)00226-5/fulltext
Everyone has opinions. Which is good.
Valid opinions are based in supporting data.
Re the "protection" that seems to be overwhelming reply to the
question for owning a gun. I wonder.
If you were to say something like "Shooting targets" there are a lot
of people (such as Frank) who will ridicule you for that. If you say "hunting" you get a response like "OH! You want to kill Bambi", but
"For protection" seems to sound a rational response that the majority
will accept.
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going out on limb >> but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him?
Roger Merriman
I admit that part of the fun of having a gun is watching the anti-gun
loonies rant and rave about it, but really, I need to carry it on my
rides to justify the slick PVC hardware I designed and made for it. It
takes the Kydex waistband holster that supplies a trigger guard.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/j_soloman/54378771817/
--
C'est bon
Soloman
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
Just because it can happen doesn?t mean it will happen, going out on limb >>> but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without >>> carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him? >>>
Roger Merriman
I admit that part of the fun of having a gun is watching the anti-gun
loonies rant and rave about it, but really, I need to carry it on my
rides to justify the slick PVC hardware I designed and made for it. It
takes the Kydex waistband holster that supplies a trigger guard.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/j_soloman/54378771817/
--
C'est bon
Soloman
Yup I *think* that youve said that you enjoy the spannering more than the >riding almost which is probably quite common for some folks and likely to
be high in this group really.
Roger Merriman
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own behavior based
on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are horribly
afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees, graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying lethal
weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in inclement
or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet found a
horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in suburban Florida, near
our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
On 3/11/2025 12:34 AM, John B. wrote:It’s unthinking Frank said A but so I must say B, which isn’t a good look!
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 08:53:40 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 8:37 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:28 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 10 Mar 2025 08:38:11 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>>>
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know
each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that you?re going to convince folks to be honest!
Roger Merriman
For the last decade or so, having a gun is becoming more popular and >>>>>>> gun laws more lax in the USA. People who fear guns and argue against >>>>>>> them are not convincing anyone.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
The number of people owning or living in a house with at least one gun, >>>>>> seems to be statistically flat, and apparently hasn’t changed since the
70’s. Seems to be just shy of 50% though the two groups would overlap so
the number of households without a gun is unlikely to 50% but lower. >>>>>>
I could well believe that there are more guns about, ie people owning >>>>>> multiple guns, as well does seem to be a hobby/thing.
Gun laws are state not country aren’t they? So presumably differs hugely.
Ie gun laws and use would differ greatly from states with big cities to >>>>>> market towns with farmers and what not.
Roger Merriman
There are notable trends. With good reason:
https://www.essence.com/news/black-women-gun-ownership-rise/
https://nationalcenter.org/ncppr/2025/03/06/craig-deluz-the-evolving-presence-of-blacks-in-the-firearms-industry/
excerpt:
“Most gun violence is committed with illegal weapons, so
increasing restrictions on legal owners only disarms those
who abide by the law.”
Those are even without clicking the links clearly opinion pieces which >>>> isn’t unexpected for US than something without the politics and dry facts
or statistics.
Roger Merriman
Oddly, anti-firearms ownership organizations publish the
same data sets:
https://www.ajpmonline.org/article/S0749-3797(24)00226-5/fulltext
Everyone has opinions. Which is good.
Valid opinions are based in supporting data.
Re the "protection" that seems to be overwhelming reply to the
question for owning a gun. I wonder.
If you were to say something like "Shooting targets" there are a lot
of people (such as Frank) who will ridicule you for that. If you say
"hunting" you get a response like "OH! You want to kill Bambi", but
"For protection" seems to sound a rational response that the majority
will accept.
Gee, that's funny, because I remember Frank saying the exact opposite of
your claim regarding target shooting and hunting. In fact, he's stated
it so many times in this forum I think I can state with a great deal of confidence that Frank has no problem with gun ownership for the purposes
of sport shooting and hunting.
How about you stop getting into a circlejerk with that floriduh dumbass
and stop lying about what Frank has said?
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 15:56:33 +0700, John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com>
wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 04:23:28 -0400, Catrike Ryder... about "noon" and...
<Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 12:50:15 +0700, John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com>
wrote:
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 22:56:08 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 8:11 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own behavior based >>>>>>>> on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are horribly >>>>>>> afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees, graveyards and more. >>>>>>>
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying lethal >>>>>>> weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in inclement >>>>>>>> or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet found a >>>>>>> horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in suburban Florida, near >>>>>>> our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
Which does not mean it's even remotely likely on the bike path where Mr. >>>>> Tricycle Rider rides. It was a one in a million event, thousands of
miles away.
His fear is as unrealistic as fear of dying from a spider bite. It's >>>>> almost as unrealistic as fear of walking past a graveyard. It's a
phobia, and his quasi-macho defense strategy is even less admirable than >>>>> clutching a teddy bear.
And you know that how? Known the guy for years, your wife and his wife >>>> are friends?
Or your sole knowledge comes from a post on the Internet?
My guess is the latter which make you a fool.
Krygowski is an angry little man who can't take being called a wussy
because he knows he is one. What kind of a "man" pursues such a
totally risk free lifestyle as he has done.
Oh but he's told us about going to work about news and working 'till
nine at night. Just think, he rides his bicycle all the way home in
the dark. Can you even begin to imagine the bravery needed to do that?
"
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
Just because it can happen doesn’t mean it will happen, going out on limb >> but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion,
shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 12:34 AM, John B. wrote:Its unthinking Frank said A but so I must say B, which isnt a good look!
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 08:53:40 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 8:37 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:28 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 10 Mar 2025 08:38:11 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know
each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that you?re going to convince folks to be honest! >>>>>>>>>
Roger Merriman
For the last decade or so, having a gun is becoming more popular and >>>>>>>> gun laws more lax in the USA. People who fear guns and argue against >>>>>>>> them are not convincing anyone.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
The number of people owning or living in a house with at least one gun, >>>>>>> seems to be statistically flat, and apparently hasnt changed since the >>>>>>> 70s. Seems to be just shy of 50% though the two groups would overlap so
the number of households without a gun is unlikely to 50% but lower. >>>>>>>
I could well believe that there are more guns about, ie people owning >>>>>>> multiple guns, as well does seem to be a hobby/thing.
Gun laws are state not country arent they? So presumably differs hugely.
Ie gun laws and use would differ greatly from states with big cities to >>>>>>> market towns with farmers and what not.
Roger Merriman
There are notable trends. With good reason:
https://www.essence.com/news/black-women-gun-ownership-rise/
https://nationalcenter.org/ncppr/2025/03/06/craig-deluz-the-evolving-presence-of-blacks-in-the-firearms-industry/
excerpt:
Most gun violence is committed with illegal weapons, so
increasing restrictions on legal owners only disarms those
who abide by the law.
Those are even without clicking the links clearly opinion pieces which >>>>> isnt unexpected for US than something without the politics and dry facts >>>>> or statistics.
Roger Merriman
Oddly, anti-firearms ownership organizations publish the
same data sets:
https://www.ajpmonline.org/article/S0749-3797(24)00226-5/fulltext
Everyone has opinions. Which is good.
Valid opinions are based in supporting data.
Re the "protection" that seems to be overwhelming reply to the
question for owning a gun. I wonder.
If you were to say something like "Shooting targets" there are a lot
of people (such as Frank) who will ridicule you for that. If you say
"hunting" you get a response like "OH! You want to kill Bambi", but
"For protection" seems to sound a rational response that the majority
will accept.
Gee, that's funny, because I remember Frank saying the exact opposite of
your claim regarding target shooting and hunting. In fact, he's stated
it so many times in this forum I think I can state with a great deal of
confidence that Frank has no problem with gun ownership for the purposes
of sport shooting and hunting.
How about you stop getting into a circlejerk with that floriduh dumbass
and stop lying about what Frank has said?
Roger Merriman
On 3/10/2025 8:11 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who
are horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work
in inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not
yet found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike
path.
And there's no evidence regarding motive, whether or not
there was a struggle, if the victim was taken by
surprise...How much good do you think carrying a gun is
going to do if you're strolling along the bike path and
someone comes up from behind and pops one into your skull?
How relevant would you consider the crime to safety of a
bike path is if the victim was specifically targeted rather
than a crime of opportunity?
This single data point hardly rationalizes carrying a gun
out of fear _literally_ 3000 miles away.
On 3/11/2025 6:47 AM, John B. wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman
<roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not
yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a
bike path.
Just because it can happen doesn’t mean it will happen,
going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe
with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having
the gun on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on
occasion,
shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give
you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
lol...yeah, let's compare an active war zone to a florida
bike path - that's rational.....
On 3/11/2025 8:58 AM, Zen Cycle wrote:
On 3/11/2025 6:47 AM, John B. wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
Just because it can happen doesn’t mean it will happen, going out on >>>> limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or
without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on
him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion,
shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
lol...yeah, let's compare an active war zone to a florida bike path -
that's rational.....
Well, there's Florida and then again there's Florida. Goes both ways in different areas and unlike Mr Tricycle I am not an expert on where/when.
A better comparison may be Vietnam in the 1960s to Chiraq yesterday
evening:
https://www.audacy.com/wbbm780/news/local/tourist-walking-11-year-old- son-shot-outside-streeterville
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish for firearms, and
the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for paranoia so
severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to do ordinary
things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill a gas tank, etc.
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias. Not this one.
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist. One classmate of
mine in an adult education class brought his handgun to a class picnic
in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy paranoia. Another guy,
less admirable in general, bragged to me about carrying his handgun
into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute stupidity, and crazy
paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that he used a special
stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly. Maybe his physical
shortcomings triggered feelings of great vulnerability, as with Mr.
Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off the charts crazy -
as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced a deranged madman shooting into a crown before, and most probably never will again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-citizen-landed-8- of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15-seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying only days after the Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without preparation is
excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some diligence and range
time.
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish for
firearms, and the effect it has on society. And I exhibit
scorn for paranoia so severe as to cause a person to
_require_ a firearm to do ordinary things like ride a
quiet bike path, drive a car, fill a gas tank, etc.
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias. Not
this one.
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist. One
classmate of mine in an adult education class brought his
handgun to a class picnic in the country. Nice guy, but
that was crazy paranoia. Another guy, less admirable in
general, bragged to me about carrying his handgun into a
folk music concert we attended. Absolute stupidity, and
crazy paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that he
used a special stand to hold his guitar out away from his
belly. Maybe his physical shortcomings triggered feelings
of great vulnerability, as with Mr. Tricycle?
Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off the charts crazy
- as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain that
this shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced
a deranged madman shooting into a crown before, and most
probably never will again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-
citizen-landed-8- of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-
shooting-in-15-seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying only
days after the Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without
preparation is excellent marksmanship. Not achievable
without some diligence and range time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for personal
protection and never take the time and diligence. If there
was a law requiring range time and accuracy to carry a gun,
I'd be a lot more confident in the general public carrying
guns. Instead, cases like this are far more prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-and- kills-mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
On Mon Mar 10 16:48:07 2025 Zen Cycle wrote:
On 3/10/2025 11:26 AM, floriduh dumbass wrote:
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 11:21:24 -0400, Frank Krygowski
Of course I won't convince a person whose most fundamental belief is "I >>>>> gotta carry a gun to be safe." Any time they hear of a similar
one-in-a-million incident occurring thousands of miles away, they take >>>>> it as "proof" that they _must_ carry their macho toy to be safe. But >>>>> they simultaneously pretend there's no fear involved, none at all!
Like I said, everyone is afraid of something. You're afraid of puppy
dogs.
Assumes facts not in evidence
Because admitting that fear contradicts their brave macho self image. >>>>I'm afraid of many things. That's why I carry several links of chain,
in addition to spare tubes, a pump, etc. I've never had to use those
links, but I got 'em in case I do. Better to have something you don't
need than not having something you need.
Changing their mind would require a Road to Damascus moment, maybe
something like accidentally shooting their best friend dead.
Oh my, be afraid, be very afraid of that...
They're
absolutely impervious to data or logic.
Why would I shoot my best friend? What's the logic of that?
WHOOSH!
On my ride today, I will not carry a gun nor be afraid. How's that for >>>>> macho? ;-)
Of course you won't. You're afraid of guns and riding with others
where you know you'll be safe takes care of that fear for you.
More tommy-lies...yes, you're not tommy, but pretty fucking close with
making up things about people for the simple reason that your butthurt
and jealous.
More empty words from the guy who claimed he rode 200 miles in a day at a 20 mph average.
Then realizing how preposterous that was erased it off of Strava.
This is the guy calling someone elseb a dumbass.
On Mon Mar 10 19:15:33 2025 Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:42 PM, AMuzi wrote:
Same here. I also carry a comb and a handkerchief. But it's pretty silly
I have carried a pocket knife since I was a child. Never sliced or
stabbed anyone but yet I carry it anyway.
to pretend that the motivation for those things is the same as the
motivation for carrying a gun.
The handkerchief is handy for blowing my nose or mopping my brow. The
pocketknife is handy for opening packages, cutting string, sharpening
pencils, etc. The comb is for combing my hair. I use all three every day.
The gun is handy for killing, or threatening to kill someone, because
you're afraid of them. AFAICT only one person here is that fearful, and
AFAICT that person has never once used the gun for its intended purpose.
I'm reminded of the joke about the guy who walked around snapping his
fingers all the time.
"Why do you keep snapping your fingers??"
"It keeps the elephants away."
"That's nuts. There are no elephants anywhere around here!"
"See? It works!!"
Frank, if I was in front of you right now, you would be so frightened that you would start crying. Your means of protection is to buy a home in an all-white neighborhood and hope you have safety in numbers.
On Mon Mar 10 08:38:11 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>>>
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know >> each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that you?re going to convince folks to be honest!
That was a good assumption until Mexico emptied its prisons and asylums into America
and Liberal DA's not only wouldn't prosecute but were were releasing murderers back onto the streets with no-cash bail. Now every citizen is fair game if you look like you have a dollar in your pocket.
On Tue Mar 11 09:56:52 2025 Zen Cycle wrote:
... about "noon" and...
and the circlejerk continues
You seem to know an awful lot about circle jerks. I called you a queer for that sort of thing.
On Tue Mar 11 10:23:20 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
Just because it can happen doesn?t mean it will happen, going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him?
It is HIS constitutional right to make that decision for himself. Murder rates in jolly ol' have been rising because the EU allowed in illegals (mostly middle easterners) which led to Brexit but the damage is already done and you do not haveconstitional rights for anything.
On Tue Mar 11 10:58:45 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going out on limb >>>> but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without >>>> carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him? >>>>
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion,
shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
I?m assuming this was the Vietnam war or similar which is a kinda difficult >> risk case to put it mildly!
And yes there are places where having a gun on you seems a wise decision,
riding your bike even in America doesn?t seems likely hence the absence of >> bike specific kit to do so.
Do you suppose that Vietnam or Laos is safe today?
On 11 Mar 2025 13:54:52 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 12:34 AM, John B. wrote:Its unthinking Frank said A but so I must say B, which isnt a good look! >>
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 08:53:40 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>
On 3/10/2025 8:37 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:28 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 10 Mar 2025 08:38:11 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know
each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that you?re going to convince folks to be honest! >>>>>>>>>>
Roger Merriman
For the last decade or so, having a gun is becoming more popular and >>>>>>>>> gun laws more lax in the USA. People who fear guns and argue against >>>>>>>>> them are not convincing anyone.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
The number of people owning or living in a house with at least one gun,
seems to be statistically flat, and apparently hasnt changed since the
70s. Seems to be just shy of 50% though the two groups would overlap so
the number of households without a gun is unlikely to 50% but lower. >>>>>>>>
I could well believe that there are more guns about, ie people owning >>>>>>>> multiple guns, as well does seem to be a hobby/thing.
Gun laws are state not country arent they? So presumably differs hugely.
Ie gun laws and use would differ greatly from states with big cities to
market towns with farmers and what not.
Roger Merriman
There are notable trends. With good reason:
https://www.essence.com/news/black-women-gun-ownership-rise/
https://nationalcenter.org/ncppr/2025/03/06/craig-deluz-the-evolving-presence-of-blacks-in-the-firearms-industry/
excerpt:
Most gun violence is committed with illegal weapons, so
increasing restrictions on legal owners only disarms those
who abide by the law.
Those are even without clicking the links clearly opinion pieces which >>>>>> isnt unexpected for US than something without the politics and dry facts
or statistics.
Roger Merriman
Oddly, anti-firearms ownership organizations publish the
same data sets:
https://www.ajpmonline.org/article/S0749-3797(24)00226-5/fulltext
Everyone has opinions. Which is good.
Valid opinions are based in supporting data.
Re the "protection" that seems to be overwhelming reply to the
question for owning a gun. I wonder.
If you were to say something like "Shooting targets" there are a lot
of people (such as Frank) who will ridicule you for that. If you say
"hunting" you get a response like "OH! You want to kill Bambi", but
"For protection" seems to sound a rational response that the majority
will accept.
Gee, that's funny, because I remember Frank saying the exact opposite of >>> your claim regarding target shooting and hunting. In fact, he's stated
it so many times in this forum I think I can state with a great deal of
confidence that Frank has no problem with gun ownership for the purposes >>> of sport shooting and hunting.
How about you stop getting into a circlejerk with that floriduh dumbass
and stop lying about what Frank has said?
Roger Merriman
Is it also not a good look if I say B so Frank must say A?
--
C'est bon
Soloman
On 3/11/2025 10:33 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:58 AM, Zen Cycle wrote:
On 3/11/2025 6:47 AM, John B. wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
Just because it can happen doesn’t mean it will happen, going out on >>>>> limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or
without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on
him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion,
shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
lol...yeah, let's compare an active war zone to a florida bike path -
that's rational.....
Well, there's Florida and then again there's Florida. Goes both ways in
different areas and unlike Mr Tricycle I am not an expert on where/when.
A better comparison may be Vietnam in the 1960s to Chiraq yesterday
evening:
https://www.audacy.com/wbbm780/news/local/tourist-walking-11-year-old-
son-shot-outside-streeterville
None of which applies to a bike path in florida
On Tue Mar 11 11:32:44 2025 Zen Cycle wrote:
On 3/11/2025 11:29 AM, cyclintom wrote:
On Tue Mar 11 09:56:52 2025 Zen Cycle wrote:
... about "noon" and...
and the circlejerk continues
You seem to know an awful lot about circle jerks. I called you a queer for that sort of thing.
Jutelist #1. Repeatedly accusing people of being "queer". He's a
closeted queer, afraid people will find out.
Your pal Obama turned up in San Francisco, He has some friends in the Castro that he came to visit. Michelle got tired of the pretend game and is off on her own now and you haven;t heard a word about those pretend children.
floriduh dumbass <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 13:54:52 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 12:34 AM, John B. wrote:Its unthinking Frank said A but so I must say B, which isnt a good look!
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 08:53:40 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>>
On 3/10/2025 8:37 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:28 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 10 Mar 2025 08:38:11 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know
each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that you?re going to convince folks to be honest! >>>>>>>>>>>
Roger Merriman
For the last decade or so, having a gun is becoming more popular and >>>>>>>>>> gun laws more lax in the USA. People who fear guns and argue against >>>>>>>>>> them are not convincing anyone.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
The number of people owning or living in a house with at least one gun,
seems to be statistically flat, and apparently hasnt changed since the
70s. Seems to be just shy of 50% though the two groups would overlap so
the number of households without a gun is unlikely to 50% but lower. >>>>>>>>>
I could well believe that there are more guns about, ie people owning >>>>>>>>> multiple guns, as well does seem to be a hobby/thing.
Gun laws are state not country arent they? So presumably differs hugely.
Ie gun laws and use would differ greatly from states with big cities to
market towns with farmers and what not.
Roger Merriman
There are notable trends. With good reason:
https://www.essence.com/news/black-women-gun-ownership-rise/
https://nationalcenter.org/ncppr/2025/03/06/craig-deluz-the-evolving-presence-of-blacks-in-the-firearms-industry/
excerpt:
Most gun violence is committed with illegal weapons, so
increasing restrictions on legal owners only disarms those
who abide by the law.
Those are even without clicking the links clearly opinion pieces which >>>>>>> isnt unexpected for US than something without the politics and dry facts
or statistics.
Roger Merriman
Oddly, anti-firearms ownership organizations publish the
same data sets:
https://www.ajpmonline.org/article/S0749-3797(24)00226-5/fulltext
Everyone has opinions. Which is good.
Valid opinions are based in supporting data.
Re the "protection" that seems to be overwhelming reply to the
question for owning a gun. I wonder.
If you were to say something like "Shooting targets" there are a lot >>>>> of people (such as Frank) who will ridicule you for that. If you say >>>>> "hunting" you get a response like "OH! You want to kill Bambi", but
"For protection" seems to sound a rational response that the majority >>>>> will accept.
Gee, that's funny, because I remember Frank saying the exact opposite of >>>> your claim regarding target shooting and hunting. In fact, he's stated >>>> it so many times in this forum I think I can state with a great deal of >>>> confidence that Frank has no problem with gun ownership for the purposes >>>> of sport shooting and hunting.
How about you stop getting into a circlejerk with that floriduh dumbass >>>> and stop lying about what Frank has said?
Roger Merriman
Is it also not a good look if I say B so Frank must say A?
On Tue Mar 11 10:23:20 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
Just because it can happen doesn?t mean it will happen, going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him?
It is HIS constitutional right to make that decision for himself. Murder rates in jolly ol' have been rising because the EU allowed in illegals (mostly middle easterners) which led to Brexit but the damage is already done and you do not haveconstitional rights for anything.
On 11 Mar 2025 10:58:45 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
Just because it can happen doesn?t mean it will happen, going out on limb >>>> but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without >>>> carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him? >>>>
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion,
shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
Im assuming this was the Vietnam war or similar which is a kinda difficult >> risk case to put it mildly!
And yes there are places where having a gun on you seems a wise decision,
riding your bike even in America doesnt seems likely hence the absence of >> bike specific kit to do so.
Roger Merriman
So far, nobody has offered any valid evidence as to why I shouldn't
carry a gun on my bike rides other than that they don't approve of it.
As for kit, there are many pieces of gear with which to do it. I chose
to make my own.
-
C'est bon
Soloman
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 13:54:52 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 12:34 AM, John B. wrote:Its unthinking Frank said A but so I must say B, which isnt a good look!
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 08:53:40 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>>
On 3/10/2025 8:37 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:28 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 10 Mar 2025 08:38:11 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know
each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that you?re going to convince folks to be honest! >>>>>>>>>>>
Roger Merriman
For the last decade or so, having a gun is becoming more popular and >>>>>>>>>> gun laws more lax in the USA. People who fear guns and argue against >>>>>>>>>> them are not convincing anyone.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
The number of people owning or living in a house with at least one gun,
seems to be statistically flat, and apparently hasnt changed since the
70s. Seems to be just shy of 50% though the two groups would overlap so
the number of households without a gun is unlikely to 50% but lower. >>>>>>>>>
I could well believe that there are more guns about, ie people owning >>>>>>>>> multiple guns, as well does seem to be a hobby/thing.
Gun laws are state not country arent they? So presumably differs hugely.
Ie gun laws and use would differ greatly from states with big cities to
market towns with farmers and what not.
Roger Merriman
There are notable trends. With good reason:
https://www.essence.com/news/black-women-gun-ownership-rise/
https://nationalcenter.org/ncppr/2025/03/06/craig-deluz-the-evolving-presence-of-blacks-in-the-firearms-industry/
excerpt:
Most gun violence is committed with illegal weapons, so
increasing restrictions on legal owners only disarms those
who abide by the law.
Those are even without clicking the links clearly opinion pieces which >>>>>>> isnt unexpected for US than something without the politics and dry facts
or statistics.
Roger Merriman
Oddly, anti-firearms ownership organizations publish the
same data sets:
https://www.ajpmonline.org/article/S0749-3797(24)00226-5/fulltext
Everyone has opinions. Which is good.
Valid opinions are based in supporting data.
Re the "protection" that seems to be overwhelming reply to the
question for owning a gun. I wonder.
If you were to say something like "Shooting targets" there are a lot >>>>> of people (such as Frank) who will ridicule you for that. If you say >>>>> "hunting" you get a response like "OH! You want to kill Bambi", but
"For protection" seems to sound a rational response that the majority >>>>> will accept.
Gee, that's funny, because I remember Frank saying the exact opposite of >>>> your claim regarding target shooting and hunting. In fact, he's stated >>>> it so many times in this forum I think I can state with a great deal of >>>> confidence that Frank has no problem with gun ownership for the purposes >>>> of sport shooting and hunting.
How about you stop getting into a circlejerk with that floriduh dumbass >>>> and stop lying about what Frank has said?
Roger Merriman
Is it also not a good look if I say B so Frank must say A?
--
C'est bon
Soloman
I and Frank disagree on number of subjects but it’s A) civil B) not just unthinking knee jerk reactions.
Roger Merriman
Youngstown is one of the most dangerous cities in America so you don't have to look thousands of miles away.
So you retain peace of mind simply by not reading ther paper.
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:58:45 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
Just because it can happen doesn?t mean it will happen, going out on limb >>>>> but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without >>>>> carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him? >>>>>
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion,
shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
I?m assuming this was the Vietnam war or similar which is a kinda difficult >>> risk case to put it mildly!
And yes there are places where having a gun on you seems a wise decision, >>> riding your bike even in America doesn?t seems likely hence the absence of >>> bike specific kit to do so.
Roger Merriman
So far, nobody has offered any valid evidence as to why I shouldn't
carry a gun on my bike rides other than that they don't approve of it.
Thats the individual want vs social gain, though Im more cynical than
Frank that reducing guns will solve the problem completely ie I think its >probably somewhat simplistic and some of it would seem to be cultural which >would require more than just lack of access.
As for kit, there are many pieces of gear with which to do it. I chose
to make my own.
Seem to remember from last time you can get Amazon and similar stuff, but >seems to be notable by its absence with companies that make all sorts of
bike accessories.
Or various bike media which if Gravel is heavily US based and bear spray
and so on do come up, gun holsters etc dont
Im unconvinced its common possible more so with folks in civies just >popping to shop if they are the sort of folks that carry guns, but folks >going for a MTB/Gravel/road ride doesnt appear to be a thing, and folks
make videos about all sorts of stuff.
Roger Merriman
-
C'est bon
Soloman
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 14:56:02 GMT, cyclintom <cyclintom@yahoo.com>
wrote:
Youngstown is one of the most dangerous cities in America so you don't have to look thousands of miles away.
Now that we've renamed the gulf of Mexico, does "America" now include
Mexico, Canada, Central America and South America? (Just curious
which cities you included in your amazing fact).
Reading the paper? All of our local newspapers (which actually print
the news) are down a few pages of tiny print. I suspect you haven't
seen a printed newspaper in the last few years. Also, the prices are
quite high. For example:
<https://newsrates.com/product/the-mercury-news/>
Would you believe a 70% discount? The only reason I know this is
because I asked a news junkie friend to save for me some old
newspapers for starting the fire in my wood burner. I get my news
online.
I went through various lists of crime statistics in the US. None of
them list Youngstown, Ohio. This is the best I could find: <https://realestate.usnews.com/places/ohio/youngstown/crime>
"The metropolitan area's violent crime rate was higher than the
national rate in 2022. Its rate of property crime was higher than the national rate."
<https://crimegrade.org/safest-places-in-youngstown-oh/>
Looks like the downtown Youngstown area has a crime problem, while the suburbs are better.
In other words, the Youngstown crime rate is below the USA average (or median) but not even close to being "one of the most dangerous cities
in America".
So you retain peace of mind simply by not reading ther paper.
Peace of mind is not obtained by being ignorant.
"War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength" From "1984"
by George Orwell.
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 13:54:52 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 12:34 AM, John B. wrote:It?s unthinking Frank said A but so I must say B, which isn?t a good look! >>>
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 08:53:40 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>>
On 3/10/2025 8:37 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:28 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 10 Mar 2025 08:38:11 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know
each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that you?re going to convince folks to be honest! >>>>>>>>>>>
Roger Merriman
For the last decade or so, having a gun is becoming more popular and >>>>>>>>>> gun laws more lax in the USA. People who fear guns and argue against >>>>>>>>>> them are not convincing anyone.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
The number of people owning or living in a house with at least one gun,
seems to be statistically flat, and apparently hasn?t changed since the
70?s. Seems to be just shy of 50% though the two groups would overlap so
the number of households without a gun is unlikely to 50% but lower. >>>>>>>>>
I could well believe that there are more guns about, ie people owning >>>>>>>>> multiple guns, as well does seem to be a hobby/thing.
Gun laws are state not country aren?t they? So presumably differs hugely.
Ie gun laws and use would differ greatly from states with big cities to
market towns with farmers and what not.
Roger Merriman
There are notable trends. With good reason:
https://www.essence.com/news/black-women-gun-ownership-rise/
https://nationalcenter.org/ncppr/2025/03/06/craig-deluz-the-evolving-presence-of-blacks-in-the-firearms-industry/
excerpt:
?Most gun violence is committed with illegal weapons, so
increasing restrictions on legal owners only disarms those
who abide by the law.?
Those are even without clicking the links clearly opinion pieces which >>>>>>> isn?t unexpected for US than something without the politics and dry facts
or statistics.
Roger Merriman
Oddly, anti-firearms ownership organizations publish the
same data sets:
https://www.ajpmonline.org/article/S0749-3797(24)00226-5/fulltext
Everyone has opinions. Which is good.
Valid opinions are based in supporting data.
Re the "protection" that seems to be overwhelming reply to the
question for owning a gun. I wonder.
If you were to say something like "Shooting targets" there are a lot >>>>> of people (such as Frank) who will ridicule you for that. If you say >>>>> "hunting" you get a response like "OH! You want to kill Bambi", but
"For protection" seems to sound a rational response that the majority >>>>> will accept.
Gee, that's funny, because I remember Frank saying the exact opposite of >>>> your claim regarding target shooting and hunting. In fact, he's stated >>>> it so many times in this forum I think I can state with a great deal of >>>> confidence that Frank has no problem with gun ownership for the purposes >>>> of sport shooting and hunting.
How about you stop getting into a circlejerk with that floriduh dumbass >>>> and stop lying about what Frank has said?
Roger Merriman
Is it also not a good look if I say B so Frank must say A?
--
C'est bon
Soloman
I and Frank disagree on number of subjects but its A) civil B) not just >unthinking knee jerk reactions.
Roger Merriman
Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 10:33 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:58 AM, Zen Cycle wrote:
On 3/11/2025 6:47 AM, John B. wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going out on >>>>>> limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or
without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on >>>>>> him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion,
shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
lol...yeah, let's compare an active war zone to a florida bike path -
that's rational.....
Well, there's Florida and then again there's Florida. Goes both ways in >>> different areas and unlike Mr Tricycle I am not an expert on where/when. >>>
A better comparison may be Vietnam in the 1960s to Chiraq yesterday
evening:
https://www.audacy.com/wbbm780/news/local/tourist-walking-11-year-old-
son-shot-outside-streeterville
None of which applies to a bike path in florida
+1
Be more truthful if folks just said they like guns, than the reaching for >justification which isnt going to convince anyone!
Roger Merriman
The smaller knife is my EDC (every day carry). The larger knife isI remember in 5th grade, one teacher needed a knife for something and
for when I misplace the smaller knife. The Leatherman Wave is for
when I'm working in the woods.
On 3/11/2025 1:10 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 14:56:02 GMT, cyclintom <cyclintom@yahoo.com>
wrote:
Youngstown is one of the most dangerous cities in America so you don't have to look thousands of miles away.
Now that we've renamed the gulf of Mexico, does "America" now include
Mexico, Canada, Central America and South America? (Just curious
which cities you included in your amazing fact).
Reading the paper? All of our local newspapers (which actually print
the news) are down a few pages of tiny print. I suspect you haven't
seen a printed newspaper in the last few years. Also, the prices are
quite high. For example:
<https://newsrates.com/product/the-mercury-news/>
Would you believe a 70% discount? The only reason I know this is
because I asked a news junkie friend to save for me some old
newspapers for starting the fire in my wood burner. I get my news
online.
I went through various lists of crime statistics in the US. None of
them list Youngstown, Ohio. This is the best I could find:
<https://realestate.usnews.com/places/ohio/youngstown/crime>
"The metropolitan area's violent crime rate was higher than the
national rate in 2022. Its rate of property crime was higher than the
national rate."
<https://crimegrade.org/safest-places-in-youngstown-oh/>
Looks like the downtown Youngstown area has a crime problem, while the
suburbs are better.
In other words, the Youngstown crime rate is below the USA average (or
median) but not even close to being "one of the most dangerous cities
in America".
So you retain peace of mind simply by not reading ther paper.
Peace of mind is not obtained by being ignorant.
For many, it is. Just look at how comfortable the two most willfully
ignorant trollsters in this forum are wit their woefully misinformed >opinions.
"War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength" From "1984"
by George Orwell.
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 13:43:45 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 1:10 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 14:56:02 GMT, cyclintom <cyclintom@yahoo.com>
wrote:
Youngstown is one of the most dangerous cities in America so you don't have to look thousands of miles away.
Now that we've renamed the gulf of Mexico, does "America" now include
Mexico, Canada, Central America and South America? (Just curious
which cities you included in your amazing fact).
Reading the paper? All of our local newspapers (which actually print
the news) are down a few pages of tiny print. I suspect you haven't
seen a printed newspaper in the last few years. Also, the prices are
quite high. For example:
<https://newsrates.com/product/the-mercury-news/>
Would you believe a 70% discount? The only reason I know this is
because I asked a news junkie friend to save for me some old
newspapers for starting the fire in my wood burner. I get my news
online.
I went through various lists of crime statistics in the US. None of
them list Youngstown, Ohio. This is the best I could find:
<https://realestate.usnews.com/places/ohio/youngstown/crime>
"The metropolitan area's violent crime rate was higher than the
national rate in 2022. Its rate of property crime was higher than the
national rate."
<https://crimegrade.org/safest-places-in-youngstown-oh/>
Looks like the downtown Youngstown area has a crime problem, while the
suburbs are better.
In other words, the Youngstown crime rate is below the USA average (or
median) but not even close to being "one of the most dangerous cities
in America".
So you retain peace of mind simply by not reading ther paper.
Peace of mind is not obtained by being ignorant.
For many, it is. Just look at how comfortable the two most willfully
ignorant trollsters in this forum are wit their woefully misinformed
opinions.
"War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength" From "1984"
by George Orwell.
Peace of mind is not obtained by listening to politicians or the
mainstream news media.
Well, maybe it is for some....
--
C'est bon
Soloman
On 11 Mar 2025 15:46:28 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
cyclintom <cyclintom@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Tue Mar 11 10:58:45 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going out on limb >>>>>> but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without >>>>>> carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him? >>>>>>
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion,
shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
I?m assuming this was the Vietnam war or similar which is a kinda difficult
risk case to put it mildly!
And yes there are places where having a gun on you seems a wise decision, >>>> riding your bike even in America doesn?t seems likely hence the absence of >>>> bike specific kit to do so.
Do you suppose that Vietnam or Laos is safe today?
Id assume so yes, Id confidently predict it has lower violent crime rate >> than US, certainly folks who have gone there or lived there havent claimed >> they needed a gun or someone with gun for protection!
Roger Merriman
I can't speak for Vietnam or Laos, which are both Communist, but in Thailand, my nephew - manages a family business in the village -
estimates that every business will have at least one gun (legal or
not) on the premises and all gold shops, for sure, will have one at
the sales counter, and they will shoot.
On 3/11/2025 8:27 PM, John B. wrote:
Nope, in one of Frank's tirades against guns he posted a photo of
people shooting at some sort of pistol match as evidence of how
ridicules it was.
Wrong. Or a lie.
Post a link to prove your claim.
On 3/11/2025 4:06 AM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 22:57:44 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 8:27 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
For many years, I've carried a gun in a
shoulder holster when I've been driving long distance, even in states
when it wasn't legal to do so. Standing beside the car or truck while
pumping gas at 0200 seemed to warrant it.
Damn. What a timid, fearful man!
<chuckle> It's almost too easy to trigger Krygowski's anger. My guns
and I own the little wuss.
On 3/11/2025 1:19 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
I'm only responding to his nastiness.
I understand why you come to
his defense... because he's not capable of defending himself.
Let's remember: Your endless snit began when I said something like "If
you lack the courage or competence to ride on normal roads, it's fine to
keep riding back and forth on your bike path. But that would be too
boring for me."
Admittedly, that didn't display immense respect for your abilities. But anyone who wasn't an insecure and fragile snowflake would have shrugged
i off. Instead you flew into a rage and began truly nasty attacks on
almost every post I've made since.
I don't usually respond because you're deeply into Troll Mode, you're intellectually weak, and you're not worthy of response.
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 09:58:04 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 6:47 AM, John B. wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
Just because it can happen doesn’t mean it will happen, going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without >>>> carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him? >>>>
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion,
shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
lol...yeah, let's compare an active war zone to a florida bike path -
that's rational.....
The point was, as I did state, "you felt more secure "even when they
weren't shooting"
But as I've said (many times) it is legal in Florida. You would deny
someone the right to do something that is legal?
Isn't it still a
(sort of) democracy back there?
On 3/11/2025 4:06 AM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025 22:57:44 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 8:27 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
For many years, I've carried a gun in a
shoulder holster when I've been driving long distance, even in states
when it wasn't legal to do so. Standing beside the car or truck while
pumping gas at 0200 seemed to warrant it.
Damn. What a timid, fearful man!
<chuckle> It's almost too easy to trigger Krygowski's anger. My guns
and I own the little wuss.
:-) That made me laugh! I point out how timid you are, and you think
that means I'm mad?
Nice try. :-)
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 15:46:28 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
cyclintom <cyclintom@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Tue Mar 11 10:58:45 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>>
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path. >>>>>>>>
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion, >>>>>> shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
I?m assuming this was the Vietnam war or similar which is a kinda difficult
risk case to put it mildly!
And yes there are places where having a gun on you seems a wise decision, >>>>> riding your bike even in America doesn?t seems likely hence the absence of
bike specific kit to do so.
Do you suppose that Vietnam or Laos is safe today?
I?d assume so yes, I?d confidently predict it has lower violent crime rate >>> than US, certainly folks who have gone there or lived there haven?t claimed >>> they needed a gun or someone with gun for protection!
Roger Merriman
I can't speak for Vietnam or Laos, which are both Communist, but in
Thailand, my nephew - manages a family business in the village -
estimates that every business will have at least one gun (legal or
not) on the premises and all gold shops, for sure, will have one at
the sales counter, and they will shoot.
That is moving goal posts, ie folks are using guns as deterrent against >robbery at high value stores.
And yes guns can be a deterrent, here as the armed police are so lethal,
and using a gun will make you a target both literally and for
investigation, so only very dumb folks use guns as the risks are so high,
and tend to pay the price for doing so.
Thats rather different to having a gun, for bike ride or popping to the >shops and so on.
Roger Merriman
On 3/11/2025 8:37 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 09:58:04 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 6:47 AM, John B. wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going out on limb >>>>> but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without >>>>> carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him? >>>>>
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion,
shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
lol...yeah, let's compare an active war zone to a florida bike path -
that's rational.....
The point was, as I did state, "you felt more secure "even when they
weren't shooting"
Comparing a bike path in floriduh in 2025 to vietnam in 1970 isn't
rational, in fact, it's pretty fucking stupid....kunich-level stupid.
But as I've said (many times) it is legal in Florida. You would deny
someone the right to do something that is legal?
nope, if he wants to carry a gun, he's free to do so. His rationale for >carrying one is weak in that the risk of being attacked on the trail is
less than being struck by lightening, and the idea that a fragile old
man with his admitted deteriorating motor skills, eyesight, and hearing
could actually defend himself without an assailant taking the gun from
him and pistol whipping him with it is laughable.
But in the immortal words of Mason Williams, "one day you realize that
'I Want to' is the worlds greatest reason".
Isn't it still a
(sort of) democracy back there?
The fact that there is no linkage between a working democracy and the
"right" to own guns notwithstanding, the answer to that question is:
Sort of, but it's slipping fast. In 2022 trump stated A Massive Fraud
of this type and magnitude allows for the termination of all rules, >regulations, and articles, even those found in the Constitution,. Throw
in the recent SCOTUS decision that gave trump broad immunity by ruling
that the president is immune from prosecution for any and all official
acts committed as president, followed by his more recent X postings He
who saves his Country does not violate any Law (not just once, but
twice). Trump is emboldened to ignore the rule of law, which is not
unlimited to blatantly unconstitutional acts (He's already done that
with his refusal to honor the spending bills passed by congress -
essentially implementing line-item vetos pafter the fact - clearly ruled
by SCOTUS as unconstitutional numerous times.
This is the man(?) that the majority of americans voted for. So you tell
me, do we still have a democracy?
On 12 Mar 2025 06:31:29 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:High value stores??? My Nephew sells, among other thing, noodles -
On 11 Mar 2025 15:46:28 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
cyclintom <cyclintom@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Tue Mar 11 10:58:45 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>>>
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are >>>>>>>>>> horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in >>>>>>>>>>> inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet >>>>>>>>>> found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path. >>>>>>>>>
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion, >>>>>>> shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
I?m assuming this was the Vietnam war or similar which is a kinda difficult
risk case to put it mildly!
And yes there are places where having a gun on you seems a wise decision,
riding your bike even in America doesn?t seems likely hence the absence of
bike specific kit to do so.
Do you suppose that Vietnam or Laos is safe today?
I?d assume so yes, I?d confidently predict it has lower violent crime rate >>>> than US, certainly folks who have gone there or lived there haven?t claimed
they needed a gun or someone with gun for protection!
Roger Merriman
I can't speak for Vietnam or Laos, which are both Communist, but in
Thailand, my nephew - manages a family business in the village -
estimates that every business will have at least one gun (legal or
not) on the premises and all gold shops, for sure, will have one at
the sales counter, and they will shoot.
That is moving goal posts, ie folks are using guns as deterrent against >>robbery at high value stores.
(:-) they are a wholesale food stuff store - where restraints and
other food sellers get their stuff.
And yes guns can be a deterrent, here as the armed police are so lethal, >>and using a gun will make you a target both literally and for >>investigation, so only very dumb folks use guns as the risks are so high, >>and tend to pay the price for doing so.
Thats rather different to having a gun, for bike ride or popping to the >>shops and so on.
Roger Merriman
The point I was trying to make is that carrying a gun in Florida is
lawful and I might add recommended by high level Police Officers
there. Why should someone be condemned for doing something that is
perfectly legal?
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish for firearms, and >>>> the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for paranoia so
severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to do ordinary
things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill a gas tank, etc. >>>>
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias. Not this one.
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist. One classmate of
mine in an adult education class brought his handgun to a class picnic >>>> in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy paranoia. Another guy,
less admirable in general, bragged to me about carrying his handgun
into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute stupidity, and crazy
paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that he used a special >>>> stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly. Maybe his physical
shortcomings triggered feelings of great vulnerability, as with Mr.
Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off the charts crazy -
as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced a deranged madman >>> shooting into a crown before, and most probably never will again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-citizen-landed-8-
of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15-seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying only days after the
Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without preparation is
excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some diligence and range
time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for personal protection and
never take the time and diligence. If there was a law requiring range
time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more confident in the
general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like this are far more
prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-and-kills-mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend committed an illegal
act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about a legal act.
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
On 3/11/2025 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish for firearms, and >>>>> the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for paranoia so
severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to do ordinary
things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill a gas tank, etc. >>>>>
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias. Not this one.
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist. One classmate of
mine in an adult education class brought his handgun to a class picnic >>>>> in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy paranoia. Another guy,
less admirable in general, bragged to me about carrying his handgun
into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute stupidity, and crazy >>>>> paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that he used a special >>>>> stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly. Maybe his physical >>>>> shortcomings triggered feelings of great vulnerability, as with Mr.
Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off the charts crazy - >>>>> as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced a deranged madman >>>> shooting into a crown before, and most probably never will again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-citizen-landed-8-
of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15-seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying only days after the >>>> Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without preparation is
excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some diligence and range >>>> time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for personal protection and >>> never take the time and diligence. If there was a law requiring range
time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more confident in the
general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like this are far more
prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-and-kills-mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend committed an illegal
act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about a legal act.
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
not much. The gun fetishists (lobby) thinks any restrictions on gun
ownership are unconstitutional. In their (small) minds, the boyfriend
did nothing wrong.
Besides, there's this:
https://www.fox13news.com/news/parents-4-year-old-boy-who-accidentally-shot-killed-himself-will-not-be-charged-davenport-police
The child found the gun underneath the seat underneath the seat
accidentally shot himself. No laws were broken. In floriduh, HB 1087 was >introduced that would have required owners to lock their firearms in a
trunk or glove box when left inside an unoccupied car. It died in committe.
Then there's this: >https://nypost.com/2024/08/26/us-news/5-year-old-utah-boy-dies-after-shooting-himself-with-parents-gun/
Again, no laws were broken, there is no Utah law against leaving
unattended weapons accessible to minors, and also does not require
weapons to be secured.
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 03:50:41 -0400, zen cycle
<funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:37 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 09:58:04 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 6:47 AM, John B. wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without >>>>>> carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him? >>>>>>
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion,
shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
lol...yeah, let's compare an active war zone to a florida bike path -
that's rational.....
The point was, as I did state, "you felt more secure "even when they
weren't shooting"
Comparing a bike path in floriduh in 2025 to vietnam in 1970 isn't >>rational, in fact, it's pretty fucking stupid....kunich-level stupid.
Are you really that dense that you don't understand the phrase " a
firearm did give you a certain sense of security :-)"
I might add that the first Usian I saw shot was shot by (likely) a S. >Vietnamese - "joy shots" during Tet
But again, it is legal and even recommended by at least one high level
police officer. Who are you, or Frankie, for that matter, to deny some
one the right to do something that is lawful to do?
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 04:19:11 -0400, zen cycle
<funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish for firearms, and >>>>>> the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for paranoia so
severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to do ordinary
things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill a gas tank, etc. >>>>>>
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias. Not this one. >>>>>>
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist. One classmate of >>>>>> mine in an adult education class brought his handgun to a class picnic >>>>>> in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy paranoia. Another guy, >>>>>> less admirable in general, bragged to me about carrying his handgun >>>>>> into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute stupidity, and crazy >>>>>> paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that he used a special >>>>>> stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly. Maybe his physical >>>>>> shortcomings triggered feelings of great vulnerability, as with Mr. >>>>>> Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off the charts crazy - >>>>>> as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced a deranged madman >>>>> shooting into a crown before, and most probably never will again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-citizen-landed-8- >>>>> of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15-seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying only days after the >>>>> Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without preparation is
excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some diligence and range >>>>> time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for personal protection and >>>> never take the time and diligence. If there was a law requiring range
time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more confident in the
general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like this are far more
prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-and-kills-mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend committed an illegal
act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about a legal act.
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
not much. The gun fetishists (lobby) thinks any restrictions on gun >>ownership are unconstitutional. In their (small) minds, the boyfriend
did nothing wrong.
Besides, there's this:
https://www.fox13news.com/news/parents-4-year-old-boy-who-accidentally-shot-killed-himself-will-not-be-charged-davenport-police
The child found the gun underneath the seat underneath the seat >>accidentally shot himself. No laws were broken. In floriduh, HB 1087 was >>introduced that would have required owners to lock their firearms in a >>trunk or glove box when left inside an unoccupied car. It died in committe. >>
Then there's this: >>https://nypost.com/2024/08/26/us-news/5-year-old-utah-boy-dies-after-shooting-himself-with-parents-gun/
Again, no laws were broken, there is no Utah law against leaving
unattended weapons accessible to minors, and also does not require
weapons to be secured.
https://www.fox13news.com/news/parents-4-year-old-boy-who-accidentally-shot-killed-himself-will-not-be-charged-davenport-police
"The child found the gun underneath the seat underneath the seat
accidentally shot himself. No laws were broken. In floriduh, HB 1087
was introduced that would have required owners to lock their firearms
in a trunk or glove box when left inside an unoccupied car. It died in >committe."
Nope, it was signed into law. >https://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2023/1087/?Tab=BillHistory
However, I agree with Chief Parker that the law didn't go far enough.
It should be a felony for some moron to leave a gun laying around in
an unoccupied car.
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 04:19:11 -0400, zen cycle
<funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish for firearms, and >>>>>> the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for paranoia so
severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to do ordinary
things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill a gas tank, etc. >>>>>>
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias. Not this one. >>>>>>
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist. One classmate of >>>>>> mine in an adult education class brought his handgun to a class picnic >>>>>> in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy paranoia. Another guy, >>>>>> less admirable in general, bragged to me about carrying his handgun >>>>>> into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute stupidity, and crazy >>>>>> paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that he used a special >>>>>> stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly. Maybe his physical >>>>>> shortcomings triggered feelings of great vulnerability, as with Mr. >>>>>> Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off the charts crazy - >>>>>> as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced a deranged madman >>>>> shooting into a crown before, and most probably never will again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-citizen-landed-8- >>>>> of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15-seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying only days after the >>>>> Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without preparation is
excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some diligence and range >>>>> time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for personal protection and >>>> never take the time and diligence. If there was a law requiring range
time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more confident in the
general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like this are far more
prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-and-kills-mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend committed an illegal
act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about a legal act.
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
not much. The gun fetishists (lobby) thinks any restrictions on gun >>ownership are unconstitutional. In their (small) minds, the boyfriend
did nothing wrong.
Re restrictions on gun ownership???
The first piece of national gun control legislation was passed on June
26, 1934. The National Firearms Act (NFA)
On 3/11/2025 11:09 AM, cyclintom wrote:
Frank, if I was in front of you right now, you would be so frightened that you would start crying.
:-) Wow, Tom, you're SO scary!
Your means of protection is to buy a home in an all-white neighborhood and hope you have safety in numbers.
Our previous house was on the edge of a solidly black neighborhood. This
was in the deeply segregated south. Despite frequent warnings from
fearful white folk, I rode my bike through that neighborhood ~daily to
get to and from work.
But I do love this neighborhood much better. Tom, you should spend a
million or so and move out of the hellhole you've done so much
complaining about!
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 03:50:41 -0400, zen cycle
<funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:37 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 09:58:04 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 6:47 AM, John B. wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
Just because it can happen doesn’t mean it will happen, going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without >>>>>> carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him? >>>>>>
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion,
shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
lol...yeah, let's compare an active war zone to a florida bike path -
that's rational.....
The point was, as I did state, "you felt more secure "even when they
weren't shooting"
Comparing a bike path in floriduh in 2025 to vietnam in 1970 isn't
rational, in fact, it's pretty fucking stupid....kunich-level stupid.
Are you really that dense that you don't understand the phrase " a
firearm did give you a certain sense of security :-)"
I might add that the first Usian I saw shot was shot by (likely) a S. Vietnamese - "joy shots" during Tet
But again, it is legal and even recommended by at least one high level
police officer. Who are you, or Frankie, for that matter, to deny some
one the right to do something that is lawful to do?
On 3/11/2025 8:50 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:56 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 8:11 PM, AMuzi wrote:
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a
bike path.
Which does not mean it's even remotely likely on the bike
path where Mr. Tricycle Rider rides. It was a one in a
million event, thousands of miles away.
His fear is as unrealistic as fear of dying from a spider
bite. It's almost as unrealistic as fear of walking past
a graveyard. It's a phobia, and his quasi-macho defense
strategy is even less admirable than clutching a teddy bear.
OK, the risk is remote. But it's not zero.
Andrew, no risk is zero. But rational and non-phobic
people's assessment of most risks is _usually_ at least
vaguely related to the actual likelihood of the bad event.
That's not true for some "dangers," like spiders and snakes.
There are fewer than ten deaths from each per year in the
U.S. Yet many people are completely irrational in those
phobias.
Mr. Tricycle is similarly irrational in his fear of riding a
bike path without his gun. And he's lately let us know that
he's also afraid of driving without a gun or pumping gas
without a gun. He's afraid of pedaling on normal streets,
too, gun or no. Remember, he's still in an endless snit
because I said that if he lacked the courage or competence
to ride normal roads, he could continue just riding back and
forth on his path, but it would be too boring for me.
His fears are not normal, and his fearful behavior is not
admirable.
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 04:19:11 -0400, zen cycle
<funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish for firearms, and >>>>>> the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for paranoia so
severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to do ordinary
things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill a gas tank, etc. >>>>>>
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias. Not this one. >>>>>>
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist. One classmate of >>>>>> mine in an adult education class brought his handgun to a class picnic >>>>>> in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy paranoia. Another guy, >>>>>> less admirable in general, bragged to me about carrying his handgun >>>>>> into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute stupidity, and crazy >>>>>> paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that he used a special >>>>>> stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly. Maybe his physical >>>>>> shortcomings triggered feelings of great vulnerability, as with Mr. >>>>>> Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off the charts crazy - >>>>>> as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced a deranged madman >>>>> shooting into a crown before, and most probably never will again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-citizen-landed-8- >>>>> of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15-seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying only days after the >>>>> Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without preparation is
excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some diligence and range >>>>> time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for personal protection and >>>> never take the time and diligence. If there was a law requiring range
time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more confident in the
general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like this are far more
prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-and-kills-mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend committed an illegal
act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about a legal act.
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
not much. The gun fetishists (lobby) thinks any restrictions on gun
ownership are unconstitutional. In their (small) minds, the boyfriend
did nothing wrong.
Re restrictions on gun ownership???
The first piece of national gun control legislation was passed on June
26, 1934. The National Firearms Act (NFA)
On 3/11/2025 9:34 AM, John B. wrote:
But (:-) In many states it is perfectly legal to carry a
gun and if
one wants to do so why should he be admonished for doing so?
In his case? Because it's cowardly. He does it because he's
afraid. He carries it while pumping gas because he's afraid.
On 3/11/2025 9:08 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/11/2025 5:23 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Just because it can happen doesn’t mean it will happen,
going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe
with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
Which is a personal risk assessment. His, not yours.
And as I must frequently remind people, personal assessments
can be flat out wrong. With phobias, they almost always are.
Consider the evidence on this one. It sounds like he's taken
his gun on every bike ride for many years. That's probably
hundreds of trips. Surely if he had actually had to brandish
it, let alone shoot it, he'd have told us by now.
So his hundreds personal risk assessments saying "I might
need my gun for defense today" have all proven wrong. He's
never once been right on this!
That's a uniformly crappy track record.
On 3/11/2025 10:36 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/11/2025 9:20 AM, Zen Cycle wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish
for firearms, and the effect it has on society. And I
exhibit scorn for paranoia so severe as to cause a
person to _require_ a firearm to do ordinary things
like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill a gas
tank, etc.
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias.
Not this one.
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist. One
classmate of mine in an adult education class brought
his handgun to a class picnic in the country. Nice guy,
but that was crazy paranoia. Another guy, less
admirable in general, bragged to me about carrying his
handgun into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute
stupidity, and crazy paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that he
used a special stand to hold his guitar out away from
his belly. Maybe his physical shortcomings triggered
feelings of great vulnerability, as with Mr. Tricycle?
Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off the charts
crazy - as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
Not quite, Andrew. While it's true that both the helmet
mania and the "handgun for protection" mania have been
driven largely by marketing, helmets have not killed any
innocent bystanders.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain
that this shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never
experienced a deranged madman shooting into a crown
before, and most probably never will again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-
citizen- landed-8- of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-
shooting-in-15-seconds/
:-) Our anecdote master has found another one! But that
tremendously rare "good guy with a gun" tale is buried under
thousands of "jerk with a gun" tales of deliberate or
incompetent shootings. Or incidents like Zen's example:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-and-
kills- mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Much agreed.
In the same way that red light running cyclists or the
meandering idiots in and out of a lane or the wrong-way
cyclists all drive me nuts, I very much agree that firearm
ineptitude/fecklessness/reckless disregard is a real problem.
Which is a matter of practical implementation not of
principle itself.
Right. Try enacting a law calling for serious training and
re-certification of gun owners. See what the NRA and GOA say
about that. "Hell no, we have a constitutional right to be
incompetent!"
On 3/11/2025 8:37 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 09:58:04 -0400, Zen Cycle
<funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 6:47 AM, John B. wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman
<roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people
who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not
carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to
work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've
not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a
bike path.
Just because it can happen doesn’t mean it will happen,
going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly
safe with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes
having the gun on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on
occasion,
shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did
give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
lol...yeah, let's compare an active war zone to a florida
bike path -
that's rational.....
The point was, as I did state, "you felt more secure "even
when they
weren't shooting"
Comparing a bike path in floriduh in 2025 to vietnam in 1970
isn't rational, in fact, it's pretty fucking
stupid....kunich-level stupid.
But as I've said (many times) it is legal in Florida. You
would deny
someone the right to do something that is legal?
nope, if he wants to carry a gun, he's free to do so. His
rationale for carrying one is weak in that the risk of being
attacked on the trail is less than being struck by
lightening, and the idea that a fragile old man with his
admitted deteriorating motor skills, eyesight, and hearing
could actually defend himself without an assailant taking
the gun from him and pistol whipping him with it is laughable.
But in the immortal words of Mason Williams, "one day you
realize that 'I Want to' is the worlds greatest reason".
Isn't it still a
(sort of) democracy back there?
The fact that there is no linkage between a working
democracy and the "right" to own guns notwithstanding, the
answer to that question is: Sort of, but it's slipping fast.
In 2022 trump stated “A Massive Fraud of this type and
magnitude allows for the termination of all rules,
regulations, and articles, even those found in the
Constitution,”. Throw in the recent SCOTUS decision that
gave trump broad immunity by ruling that the president is
immune from prosecution for any and all official acts
committed as president, followed by his more recent X
postings “He who saves his Country does not violate any
Law” (not just once, but twice). Trump is emboldened to
ignore the rule of law, which is not unlimited to blatantly
unconstitutional acts (He's already done that with his
refusal to honor the spending bills passed by congress -
essentially implementing line-item vetos pafter the fact -
clearly ruled by SCOTUS as unconstitutional numerous times.
This is the man(?) that the majority of americans voted for.
So you tell me, do we still have a democracy?
On 12 Mar 2025 06:31:29 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 15:46:28 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
cyclintom <cyclintom@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Tue Mar 11 10:58:45 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>>>
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are >>>>>>>>>> horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in >>>>>>>>>>> inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet >>>>>>>>>> found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path. >>>>>>>>>
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion, >>>>>>> shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
I?m assuming this was the Vietnam war or similar which is a kinda difficult
risk case to put it mildly!
And yes there are places where having a gun on you seems a wise decision,
riding your bike even in America doesn?t seems likely hence the absence of
bike specific kit to do so.
Do you suppose that Vietnam or Laos is safe today?
I?d assume so yes, I?d confidently predict it has lower violent crime rate >>>> than US, certainly folks who have gone there or lived there haven?t claimed
they needed a gun or someone with gun for protection!
Roger Merriman
I can't speak for Vietnam or Laos, which are both Communist, but in
Thailand, my nephew - manages a family business in the village -
estimates that every business will have at least one gun (legal or
not) on the premises and all gold shops, for sure, will have one at
the sales counter, and they will shoot.
That is moving goal posts, ie folks are using guns as deterrent against
robbery at high value stores.
And yes guns can be a deterrent, here as the armed police are so lethal,
and using a gun will make you a target both literally and for
investigation, so only very dumb folks use guns as the risks are so high,
and tend to pay the price for doing so.
That’s rather different to having a gun, for bike ride or popping to the >> shops and so on.
Roger Merriman
The Europeans, especially the Brits, are much more willing to let
their government run their lives for them than we USAians. The attempt
here to move us in that direction that was soundly rejected in the
last election.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
On 3/11/2025 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle
<funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish
for firearms, and
the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for
paranoia so
severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to
do ordinary
things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill a
gas tank, etc.
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias.
Not this one.
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist. One
classmate of
mine in an adult education class brought his handgun to
a class picnic
in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy paranoia.
Another guy,
less admirable in general, bragged to me about carrying
his handgun
into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute
stupidity, and crazy
paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that he
used a special
stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly. Maybe
his physical
shortcomings triggered feelings of great vulnerability,
as with Mr.
Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off the
charts crazy -
as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain
that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced a
deranged madman
shooting into a crown before, and most probably never
will again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-
citizen-landed-8-
of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15-
seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying only
days after the
Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without
preparation is
excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some
diligence and range
time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for personal
protection and
never take the time and diligence. If there was a law
requiring range
time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more
confident in the
general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like this
are far more
prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-and-
kills-mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend committed
an illegal
act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about a
legal act.
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
not much. The gun fetishists (lobby) thinks any restrictions
on gun ownership are unconstitutional. In their (small)
minds, the boyfriend did nothing wrong.
Besides, there's this:
https://www.fox13news.com/news/parents-4-year-old-boy-who- accidentally-shot-killed-himself-will-not-be-charged-
davenport-police
The child found the gun underneath the seat underneath the
seat accidentally shot himself. No laws were broken. In
floriduh, HB 1087 was introduced that would have required
owners to lock their firearms in a trunk or glove box when
left inside an unoccupied car. It died in committe.
Then there's this:
https://nypost.com/2024/08/26/us-news/5-year-old-utah-boy- dies-after-shooting-himself-with-parents-gun/
Again, no laws were broken, there is no Utah law against
leaving unattended weapons accessible to minors, and also
does not require weapons to be secured.
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 14:22:31 +0700, John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com>
wrote:
On 12 Mar 2025 06:31:29 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:High value stores??? My Nephew sells, among other thing, noodles -
On 11 Mar 2025 15:46:28 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
cyclintom <cyclintom@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Tue Mar 11 10:58:45 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are >>>>>>>>>>> horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying >>>>>>>>>>> lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in >>>>>>>>>>>> inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet >>>>>>>>>>> found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path. >>>>>>>>>>
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion, >>>>>>>> shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a >>>>>>>> certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
I?m assuming this was the Vietnam war or similar which is a kinda difficult
risk case to put it mildly!
And yes there are places where having a gun on you seems a wise decision,
riding your bike even in America doesn?t seems likely hence the absence of
bike specific kit to do so.
Do you suppose that Vietnam or Laos is safe today?
I?d assume so yes, I?d confidently predict it has lower violent crime rate
than US, certainly folks who have gone there or lived there haven?t claimed
they needed a gun or someone with gun for protection!
Roger Merriman
I can't speak for Vietnam or Laos, which are both Communist, but in
Thailand, my nephew - manages a family business in the village -
estimates that every business will have at least one gun (legal or
not) on the premises and all gold shops, for sure, will have one at
the sales counter, and they will shoot.
That is moving goal posts, ie folks are using guns as deterrent against
robbery at high value stores.
(:-) they are a wholesale food stuff store - where restraints and
other food sellers get their stuff.
And yes guns can be a deterrent, here as the armed police are so lethal, >>> and using a gun will make you a target both literally and for
investigation, so only very dumb folks use guns as the risks are so high, >>> and tend to pay the price for doing so.
That’s rather different to having a gun, for bike ride or popping to the >>> shops and so on.
Roger Merriman
The point I was trying to make is that carrying a gun in Florida is
lawful and I might add recommended by high level Police Officers
there. Why should someone be condemned for doing something that is
perfectly legal?
"The people in Polk County like guns, they have guns, I encourage them
to own guns... And if you try to break into their homes to steal, to
set fires, I'm highly recommending they blow you back out of the house
with their guns." https://www.foxnews.com/us/florida-sheriff-grady-judd-george-floyd-looters-guns
--
C'est bon
Soloman
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 04:19:11 -0400, zen cycle
<funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish for firearms, and >>>>>> the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for paranoia so
severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to do ordinary
things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill a gas tank, etc. >>>>>>
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias. Not this one. >>>>>>
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist. One classmate of >>>>>> mine in an adult education class brought his handgun to a class picnic >>>>>> in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy paranoia. Another guy, >>>>>> less admirable in general, bragged to me about carrying his handgun >>>>>> into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute stupidity, and crazy >>>>>> paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that he used a special >>>>>> stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly. Maybe his physical >>>>>> shortcomings triggered feelings of great vulnerability, as with Mr. >>>>>> Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off the charts crazy - >>>>>> as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced a deranged madman >>>>> shooting into a crown before, and most probably never will again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-citizen-landed-8- >>>>> of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15-seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying only days after the >>>>> Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without preparation is
excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some diligence and range >>>>> time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for personal protection and >>>> never take the time and diligence. If there was a law requiring range
time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more confident in the
general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like this are far more
prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-and-kills-mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend committed an illegal
act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about a legal act.
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
not much. The gun fetishists (lobby) thinks any restrictions on gun
ownership are unconstitutional. In their (small) minds, the boyfriend
did nothing wrong.
Re restrictions on gun ownership???
The first piece of national gun control legislation was passed on June
26, 1934. The National Firearms Act (NFA)
On 3/12/2025 5:32 AM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 04:19:11 -0400, zen cycle
<funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle
<funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish
for firearms, and
the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for
paranoia so
severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to
do ordinary
things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill
a gas tank, etc.
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias.
Not this one.
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist.
One classmate of
mine in an adult education class brought his handgun
to a class picnic
in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy
paranoia. Another guy,
less admirable in general, bragged to me about
carrying his handgun
into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute
stupidity, and crazy
paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that
he used a special
stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly.
Maybe his physical
shortcomings triggered feelings of great
vulnerability, as with Mr.
Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off
the charts crazy -
as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain
that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced
a deranged madman
shooting into a crown before, and most probably never
will again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-
citizen-landed-8-
of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15-
seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying
only days after the
Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without
preparation is
excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some
diligence and range
time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for
personal protection and
never take the time and diligence. If there was a law
requiring range
time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more
confident in the
general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like this
are far more
prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-
and-kills-mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend committed
an illegal
act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about a
legal act.
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
not much. The gun fetishists (lobby) thinks any
restrictions on gun
ownership are unconstitutional. In their (small) minds,
the boyfriend
did nothing wrong.
Re restrictions on gun ownership???
The first piece of national gun control legislation was
passed on June
26, 1934. The National Firearms Act (NFA)
Which is not germane to the point that the gun fetishists
(lobby) think any restrictions on gun ownership are
unconstitutional.
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 04:56:52 -0400, Catrike Ryder
<Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 04:19:11 -0400, zen cycle
<funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com> >>>> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish for firearms, and >>>>>>> the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for paranoia so >>>>>>> severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to do ordinary >>>>>>> things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill a gas tank, etc. >>>>>>>
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias. Not this one. >>>>>>>
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist. One classmate of >>>>>>> mine in an adult education class brought his handgun to a class picnic >>>>>>> in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy paranoia. Another guy, >>>>>>> less admirable in general, bragged to me about carrying his handgun >>>>>>> into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute stupidity, and crazy >>>>>>> paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that he used a special >>>>>>> stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly. Maybe his physical >>>>>>> shortcomings triggered feelings of great vulnerability, as with Mr. >>>>>>> Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off the charts crazy - >>>>>>> as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced a deranged madman >>>>>> shooting into a crown before, and most probably never will again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-citizen-landed-8- >>>>>> of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15-seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying only days after the >>>>>> Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without preparation is
excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some diligence and range >>>>>> time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for personal protection and >>>>> never take the time and diligence. If there was a law requiring range >>>>> time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more confident in the >>>>> general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like this are far more
prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-and-kills-mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend committed an illegal
act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about a legal act.
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
not much. The gun fetishists (lobby) thinks any restrictions on gun
ownership are unconstitutional. In their (small) minds, the boyfriend
did nothing wrong.
Besides, there's this:
https://www.fox13news.com/news/parents-4-year-old-boy-who-accidentally-shot-killed-himself-will-not-be-charged-davenport-police
The child found the gun underneath the seat underneath the seat
accidentally shot himself. No laws were broken. In floriduh, HB 1087 was >>> introduced that would have required owners to lock their firearms in a
trunk or glove box when left inside an unoccupied car. It died in committe. >>>
Then there's this:
https://nypost.com/2024/08/26/us-news/5-year-old-utah-boy-dies-after-shooting-himself-with-parents-gun/
Again, no laws were broken, there is no Utah law against leaving
unattended weapons accessible to minors, and also does not require
weapons to be secured.
https://www.fox13news.com/news/parents-4-year-old-boy-who-accidentally-shot-killed-himself-will-not-be-charged-davenport-police
"The child found the gun underneath the seat underneath the seat
accidentally shot himself. No laws were broken. In floriduh, HB 1087
was introduced that would have required owners to lock their firearms
in a trunk or glove box when left inside an unoccupied car. It died in
committe."
Nope, it was signed into law.
https://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2023/1087/?Tab=BillHistory
However, I agree with Chief Parker that the law didn't go far enough.
It should be a felony for some moron to leave a gun laying around in
an unoccupied car.
I should've also said that letting a gun slide around under the seat
of your vehicle is an incredibly stupid thing to do, and the glove box
is not a good place to leave it when unattended. The first place a car burglar will look is under the seat and the second place is the glove
box, which is easily opened with a screwdriver or pocket knife.
I also believe that open carry is wrong headed. Too easy to grab if
out in the open.
If I go into a restroom or a restaurant when out riding, the gun does
not get left on the Catrike. It goes into my trunk bag along with my
phone and computer and goes with me.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
On 3/12/2025 3:08 AM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On 12 Mar 2025 06:31:29 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 15:46:28 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
cyclintom <cyclintom@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Tue Mar 11 10:58:45 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are >>>>>>>>>>> horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying >>>>>>>>>>> lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in >>>>>>>>>>>> inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet >>>>>>>>>>> found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path. >>>>>>>>>>
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion, >>>>>>>> shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a >>>>>>>> certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
I?m assuming this was the Vietnam war or similar which is a kinda difficult
risk case to put it mildly!
And yes there are places where having a gun on you seems a wise decision,
riding your bike even in America doesn?t seems likely hence the absence of
bike specific kit to do so.
Do you suppose that Vietnam or Laos is safe today?
I?d assume so yes, I?d confidently predict it has lower violent crime rate
than US, certainly folks who have gone there or lived there haven?t claimed
they needed a gun or someone with gun for protection!
Roger Merriman
I can't speak for Vietnam or Laos, which are both Communist, but in
Thailand, my nephew - manages a family business in the village -
estimates that every business will have at least one gun (legal or
not) on the premises and all gold shops, for sure, will have one at
the sales counter, and they will shoot.
That is moving goal posts, ie folks are using guns as deterrent against
robbery at high value stores.
And yes guns can be a deterrent, here as the armed police are so lethal, >>> and using a gun will make you a target both literally and for
investigation, so only very dumb folks use guns as the risks are so high, >>> and tend to pay the price for doing so.
Thats rather different to having a gun, for bike ride or popping to the >>> shops and so on.
Roger Merriman
The Europeans, especially the Brits, are much more willing to let
their government run their lives for them than we USAians. The attempt
here to move us in that direction that was soundly rejected in the
last election.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
There's a similar cultural rift between US and Canadian
ethos, as applies to the relationship between the individual
and the State.
On 3/12/2025 2:50 AM, zen cycle wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:37 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 09:58:04 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 6:47 AM, John B. wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path.
Just because it can happen doesn’t mean it will happen, going out >>>>>> on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or
without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun
on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion,
shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
lol...yeah, let's compare an active war zone to a florida bike path -
that's rational.....
The point was, as I did state, "you felt more secure "even when they
weren't shooting"
Comparing a bike path in floriduh in 2025 to vietnam in 1970 isn't
rational, in fact, it's pretty fucking stupid....kunich-level stupid.
But as I've said (many times) it is legal in Florida. You would deny
someone the right to do something that is legal?
nope, if he wants to carry a gun, he's free to do so. His rationale
for carrying one is weak in that the risk of being attacked on the
trail is less than being struck by lightening, and the idea that a
fragile old man with his admitted deteriorating motor skills,
eyesight, and hearing could actually defend himself without an
assailant taking the gun from him and pistol whipping him with it is
laughable.
But in the immortal words of Mason Williams, "one day you realize that
'I Want to' is the worlds greatest reason".
Isn't it still a
(sort of) democracy back there?
The fact that there is no linkage between a working democracy and the
"right" to own guns notwithstanding, the answer to that question is:
Sort of, but it's slipping fast. In 2022 trump stated “A Massive Fraud
of this type and magnitude allows for the termination of all rules,
regulations, and articles, even those found in the Constitution,”.
Throw in the recent SCOTUS decision that gave trump broad immunity by
ruling that the president is immune from prosecution for any and all
official acts committed as president, followed by his more recent X
postings “He who saves his Country does not violate any Law” (not just >> once, but twice). Trump is emboldened to ignore the rule of law, which
is not unlimited to blatantly unconstitutional acts (He's already done
that with his refusal to honor the spending bills passed by congress -
essentially implementing line-item vetos pafter the fact - clearly
ruled by SCOTUS as unconstitutional numerous times.
This is the man(?) that the majority of americans voted for. So you
tell me, do we still have a democracy?
In the immortal and prescient words of Selena Zito from September of 2016:
“When he makes claims like this, the press takes him literally, but not seriously; his supporters take him seriously, but not literally.”
She nailed it.
Oh by the way regarding democracy, hell no! We are a Constitutional Republic not yet subject to mob rule.
On 3/11/2025 9:29 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/11/2025 10:36 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/11/2025 9:20 AM, Zen Cycle wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish for firearms, >>>>>> and the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for paranoia >>>>>> so severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to do
ordinary things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill a
gas tank, etc.
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias. Not this one. >>>>>>
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist. One classmate
of mine in an adult education class brought his handgun to a class >>>>>> picnic in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy paranoia.
Another guy, less admirable in general, bragged to me about
carrying his handgun into a folk music concert we attended.
Absolute stupidity, and crazy paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that he used a
special stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly. Maybe
his physical shortcomings triggered feelings of great
vulnerability, as with Mr. Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk
assessment was off the charts crazy - as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
Not quite, Andrew. While it's true that both the helmet mania and the
"handgun for protection" mania have been driven largely by marketing,
helmets have not killed any innocent bystanders.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced a deranged
madman shooting into a crown before, and most probably never will
again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed- citizen-
landed-8- of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass- shooting-in-15-
seconds/
:-) Our anecdote master has found another one! But that tremendously
rare "good guy with a gun" tale is buried under thousands of "jerk
with a gun" tales of deliberate or incompetent shootings. Or incidents
like Zen's example:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-and- kills-
mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Much agreed.
In the same way that red light running cyclists or the meandering
idiots in and out of a lane or the wrong-way cyclists all drive me
nuts, I very much agree that firearm ineptitude/fecklessness/reckless
disregard is a real problem.
Which is a matter of practical implementation not of principle itself.
Right. Try enacting a law calling for serious training and re-
certification of gun owners. See what the NRA and GOA say about that.
"Hell no, we have a constitutional right to be incompetent!"
"...helmets have not killed any innocent bystanders."
Nor has Mr Tricycle. Score 0-0.
:...law calling for serious training and re-certification of gun owners"
Actually, much time and expense for a couple hundred years have been
spent by service organizations (NRA, GOA), schools, Scouts, quasi- governmental programs (CMP) etc on firearms operation, safety protocols
and marksmanship. To good effect I might add.
The hundred million plusIf the laws aren't working, why not just get rid f them?
lawful firearms owners are notable primarily in the absence of
negligence and malice. More regulation, impedimenta, harassment and bureaucracy is unlikely to move the scale from 'excellent' to 'perfect'. (your opinion may vary of course)
Which cannot be said for criminal possession and use which is rampant,
laws be damned:
https://www.nbcnewyork.com/new-jersey/newark-police-shooting-teen- suspect-arrested/6178529/
Which laws?
Prohibited person in possession (14 years old)
Possession of unlicensed and untaxed full auto weapon.
Armed assault (fired first).
Assault of police officers.
Murder and attempted murder.
The murderer will not be executed for his crimes, that being New Jersey
and of course a tender youth of 14 years old.
On 3/12/2025 3:19 AM, zen cycle wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish for firearms, >>>>>> and
the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for paranoia so
severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to do ordinary
things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill a gas tank,
etc.
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias. Not this one. >>>>>>
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist. One classmate of >>>>>> mine in an adult education class brought his handgun to a class
picnic
in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy paranoia. Another guy, >>>>>> less admirable in general, bragged to me about carrying his handgun >>>>>> into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute stupidity, and crazy >>>>>> paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that he used a
special
stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly. Maybe his physical >>>>>> shortcomings triggered feelings of great vulnerability, as with Mr. >>>>>> Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off the charts crazy - >>>>>> as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced a deranged
madman
shooting into a crown before, and most probably never will again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed- citizen-landed-8- >>>>> of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15- seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying only days after
the
Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without preparation is
excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some diligence and
range
time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for personal protection
and
never take the time and diligence. If there was a law requiring range
time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more confident in the
general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like this are far more
prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-and- kills-
mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend committed an illegal
act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about a legal act.
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
not much. The gun fetishists (lobby) thinks any restrictions on gun
ownership are unconstitutional. In their (small) minds, the boyfriend
did nothing wrong.
Besides, there's this:
https://www.fox13news.com/news/parents-4-year-old-boy-who-
accidentally-shot-killed-himself-will-not-be-charged- davenport-police
The child found the gun underneath the seat underneath the seat
accidentally shot himself. No laws were broken. In floriduh, HB 1087
was introduced that would have required owners to lock their firearms
in a trunk or glove box when left inside an unoccupied car. It died in
committe.
Then there's this:
https://nypost.com/2024/08/26/us-news/5-year-old-utah-boy- dies-after-
shooting-himself-with-parents-gun/
Again, no laws were broken, there is no Utah law against leaving
unattended weapons accessible to minors, and also does not require
weapons to be secured.
Your fellow citizens enacted Massachusetts statutes apparently of a
different nature than in Utah:
https://www.mass.gov/doc/7630-improper-storage-of-a-firearm-gl-c-140- s-131l/download
Utah may revise theirs (or enforce them more rigorously. I don't
actually know). Or not.
I doubt you and I have any disagreement that it was criminal negligenceAnd with no possibility of exacting any sanctions of any types on the
in a practical and moral sense.
On 3/12/2025 4:37 AM, floriduh dumbass wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 04:19:11 -0400, zen cycle
<funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com> >>>>> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish for
firearms, and
the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for paranoia so >>>>>>>> severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to do ordinary >>>>>>>> things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill a gas
tank, etc.
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias. Not this one. >>>>>>>>
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist. One classmate of >>>>>>>> mine in an adult education class brought his handgun to a class >>>>>>>> picnic
in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy paranoia. Another guy, >>>>>>>> less admirable in general, bragged to me about carrying his handgun >>>>>>>> into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute stupidity, and >>>>>>>> crazy
paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that he used a >>>>>>>> special
stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly. Maybe his
physical
shortcomings triggered feelings of great vulnerability, as with Mr. >>>>>>>> Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off the charts
crazy -
as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced a deranged >>>>>>> madman
shooting into a crown before, and most probably never will again. >>>>>>>
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-citizen-
landed-8-
of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15-seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying only days
after the
Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without preparation is
excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some diligence and >>>>>>> range
time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for personal
protection and
never take the time and diligence. If there was a law requiring range >>>>>> time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more confident in the >>>>>> general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like this are far more >>>>>> prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-and-kills-
mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend committed an illegal
act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about a legal act.
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
not much. The gun fetishists (lobby) thinks any restrictions on gun
ownership are unconstitutional. In their (small) minds, the boyfriend
did nothing wrong.
Besides, there's this:
https://www.fox13news.com/news/parents-4-year-old-boy-who-
accidentally-shot-killed-himself-will-not-be-charged-davenport-police
The child found the gun underneath the seat underneath the seat
accidentally shot himself. No laws were broken. In floriduh, HB 1087
was
introduced that would have required owners to lock their firearms in a >>>> trunk or glove box when left inside an unoccupied car. It died in
committe.
Then there's this:
https://nypost.com/2024/08/26/us-news/5-year-old-utah-boy-dies-
after-shooting-himself-with-parents-gun/
Again, no laws were broken, there is no Utah law against leaving
unattended weapons accessible to minors, and also does not require
weapons to be secured.
https://www.fox13news.com/news/parents-4-year-old-boy-who-
accidentally-shot-killed-himself-will-not-be-charged-davenport-police
"The child found the gun underneath the seat underneath the seat
accidentally shot himself. No laws were broken. In floriduh, HB 1087
was introduced that would have required owners to lock their firearms
in a trunk or glove box when left inside an unoccupied car. It died in
committe."
Nope, it was signed into law.
https://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2023/1087/?Tab=BillHistory
However, I agree with Chief Parker that the law didn't go far enough.
It should be a felony for some moron to leave a gun laying around in
an unoccupied car.
I should've also said that letting a gun slide around under the seat
of your vehicle is an incredibly stupid thing to do, and the glove box
is not a good place to leave it when unattended. The first place a car
burglar will look is under the seat and the second place is the glove
box, which is easily opened with a screwdriver or pocket knife.
I also believe that open carry is wrong headed. Too easy to grab if
out in the open.
If I go into a restroom or a restaurant when out riding, the gun does
not get left on the Catrike. It goes into my trunk bag along with my
phone and computer and goes with me.
On 3/12/2025 9:13 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/12/2025 2:50 AM, zen cycle wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:37 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 09:58:04 -0400, Zen Cycle
<funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 6:47 AM, John B. wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman
<roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people
who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not
carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to
work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've
not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a
bike path.
Just because it can happen doesn’t mean it will
happen, going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly
safe with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes
having the gun on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did,
on occasion,
shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did
give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
lol...yeah, let's compare an active war zone to a
florida bike path -
that's rational.....
The point was, as I did state, "you felt more secure
"even when they
weren't shooting"
Comparing a bike path in floriduh in 2025 to vietnam in
1970 isn't rational, in fact, it's pretty fucking
stupid....kunich-level stupid.
But as I've said (many times) it is legal in Florida.
You would deny
someone the right to do something that is legal?
nope, if he wants to carry a gun, he's free to do so. His
rationale for carrying one is weak in that the risk of
being attacked on the trail is less than being struck by
lightening, and the idea that a fragile old man with his
admitted deteriorating motor skills, eyesight, and
hearing could actually defend himself without an
assailant taking the gun from him and pistol whipping him
with it is laughable.
But in the immortal words of Mason Williams, "one day you
realize that 'I Want to' is the worlds greatest reason".
Isn't it still a
(sort of) democracy back there?
The fact that there is no linkage between a working
democracy and the "right" to own guns notwithstanding,
the answer to that question is: Sort of, but it's
slipping fast. In 2022 trump stated “A Massive Fraud of
this type and magnitude allows for the termination of all
rules, regulations, and articles, even those found in the
Constitution,”. Throw in the recent SCOTUS decision that
gave trump broad immunity by ruling that the president is
immune from prosecution for any and all official acts
committed as president, followed by his more recent X
postings “He who saves his Country does not violate any
Law” (not just once, but twice). Trump is emboldened to
ignore the rule of law, which is not unlimited to
blatantly unconstitutional acts (He's already done that
with his refusal to honor the spending bills passed by
congress - essentially implementing line-item vetos
pafter the fact - clearly ruled by SCOTUS as
unconstitutional numerous times.
This is the man(?) that the majority of americans voted
for. So you tell me, do we still have a democracy?
In the immortal and prescient words of Selena Zito from
September of 2016:
“When he makes claims like this, the press takes him
literally, but not seriously; his supporters take him
seriously, but not literally.”
She nailed it.
nope. The recent SCOTUS decision that gave trump broad
immunity by ruling that the president is immune from
prosecution for any and all official acts committed as
president, followed by his more recent X postings “He who
saves his Country does not violate any Law” (not just once,
but twice). Trump is emboldened to ignore the rule of law,
which
is not unlimited to blatantly unconstitutional acts. He's
already done
that with his refusal to honor the spending bills passed by
congress - essentially implementing line-item vetos after
the fact - clearly ruled by SCOTUS as unconstitutional
numerous times.
Oh by the way regarding democracy, hell no! We are a
Constitutional Republic not yet subject to mob rule.
Regarding Constitutional republic, hell no! The judicial and
legislative branches have give tacit approval for the
president to ignore the constitution. If the president can
ignore the constitution, it no longer has any purpose.
On 3/12/2025 9:22 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/12/2025 3:19 AM, zen cycle wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle
<funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish
for firearms, and
the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for
paranoia so
severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to
do ordinary
things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill
a gas tank, etc.
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias.
Not this one.
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist.
One classmate of
mine in an adult education class brought his handgun
to a class picnic
in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy
paranoia. Another guy,
less admirable in general, bragged to me about
carrying his handgun
into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute
stupidity, and crazy
paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that
he used a special
stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly.
Maybe his physical
shortcomings triggered feelings of great
vulnerability, as with Mr.
Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off
the charts crazy -
as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain
that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced
a deranged madman
shooting into a crown before, and most probably never
will again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-
citizen-landed-8-
of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15-
seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying
only days after the
Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without
preparation is
excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some
diligence and range
time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for
personal protection and
never take the time and diligence. If there was a law
requiring range
time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more
confident in the
general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like this
are far more
prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-
and- kills- mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend committed
an illegal
act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about a
legal act.
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
not much. The gun fetishists (lobby) thinks any
restrictions on gun ownership are unconstitutional. In
their (small) minds, the boyfriend did nothing wrong.
Besides, there's this:
https://www.fox13news.com/news/parents-4-year-old-boy-
who- accidentally-shot-killed-himself-will-not-be-
charged- davenport-police
The child found the gun underneath the seat underneath
the seat accidentally shot himself. No laws were broken.
In floriduh, HB 1087 was introduced that would have
required owners to lock their firearms in a trunk or
glove box when left inside an unoccupied car. It died in
committe.
Then there's this:
https://nypost.com/2024/08/26/us-news/5-year-old-utah-
boy- dies-after- shooting-himself-with-parents-gun/
Again, no laws were broken, there is no Utah law against
leaving unattended weapons accessible to minors, and also
does not require weapons to be secured.
Your fellow citizens enacted Massachusetts statutes
apparently of a different nature than in Utah:
https://www.mass.gov/doc/7630-improper-storage-of-a-
firearm-gl-c-140- s-131l/download
I'm fully aware of current massachusetts firearms laws,
thank you, having completed the state mandated LTC earlier
this year (license on the way).
Utah may revise theirs (or enforce them more rigorously. I
don't actually know). Or not.
I'm going with 'not'.
And with no possibility of exacting any sanctions of any
I doubt you and I have any disagreement that it was
criminal negligence in a practical and moral sense.
types on the parents, by what motivation is there to hope
future gun owners will be any more responsible?
https://abcnews.go.com/US/father-christopher-bizilj-died- firing-uzi-urged-son/story?id=12565132
The live-firing of automatic weapons was being supervised by
a 15 - year old, The promotional advertisment for the event
said "It's all legal & fun — No permits or licenses
required!!!!"
The parent was not charged, the organizers were acquitted,
in gun-hating liberal massachusetts.
On Tue Mar 11 11:18:26 2025 Zen Cycle wrote:
On 3/11/2025 10:53 AM, cyclintom wrote:
On Mon Mar 10 08:38:11 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 2:00 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 13:51:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/9/2025 1:24 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Sun, 9 Mar 2025 10:46:25 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>>>>>
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/lasd-looking-for-2-people-seen-near-southern-california-bikeway-murder-scene/
Was it one of those "kiddie trails?"
Sounds like. BE VERY AFRAID! ;-)
Oh hell no. Got a gun.
Because you're afraid, obviously.
(OK, I'm done.)
I presume even in US that the majority of gun crime is with folks who know >>>> each other. Ie not just opportunistic crime.
Unconvinced that you?re going to convince folks to be honest!
That was a good assumption until Mexico emptied its prisons and asylums into America
lol...I'd love to hear where you got that from, the same place you heard
there was no recession before Obama took office?
and Liberal DA's not only wouldn't prosecute but were were releasing murderers back onto the streets with no-cash bail. Now every citizen is fair game if you look like you have a dollar in your pocket.
So, you're safe then.
As we all know, Obama instantly cured the recession that occurred AFTER he was elected but had yet to take office.
Obama was visiting friends in the Castro district of San Francisco the other day.
But according to Flunky, Obama isn't a queer.
Micheolle wasn't his wife but according to Flunky it was.
Those were not his children but according to Flunky they were.
They were on loan from a couple and if you saw a pictire of them together there was absolutely no question.
Only another queer could fight so hard to defemd a queer.
Tell us again how "light lines" isn't a short hand for fiber optics.
You qare an expert at these things because you've worked with them so much.
On 3/12/2025 9:13 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/12/2025 2:50 AM, zen cycle wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:37 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 09:58:04 -0400, Zen Cycle
<funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 6:47 AM, John B. wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman
<roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people
who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not
carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to
work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've
not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a
bike path.
Just because it can happen doesn’t mean it will
happen, going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly
safe with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes
having the gun on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did,
on occasion,
shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did
give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
lol...yeah, let's compare an active war zone to a
florida bike path -
that's rational.....
The point was, as I did state, "you felt more secure
"even when they
weren't shooting"
Comparing a bike path in floriduh in 2025 to vietnam in
1970 isn't rational, in fact, it's pretty fucking
stupid....kunich-level stupid.
But as I've said (many times) it is legal in Florida.
You would deny
someone the right to do something that is legal?
nope, if he wants to carry a gun, he's free to do so. His
rationale for carrying one is weak in that the risk of
being attacked on the trail is less than being struck by
lightening, and the idea that a fragile old man with his
admitted deteriorating motor skills, eyesight, and
hearing could actually defend himself without an
assailant taking the gun from him and pistol whipping him
with it is laughable.
But in the immortal words of Mason Williams, "one day you
realize that 'I Want to' is the worlds greatest reason".
Isn't it still a
(sort of) democracy back there?
The fact that there is no linkage between a working
democracy and the "right" to own guns notwithstanding,
the answer to that question is: Sort of, but it's
slipping fast. In 2022 trump stated “A Massive Fraud of
this type and magnitude allows for the termination of all
rules, regulations, and articles, even those found in the
Constitution,”. Throw in the recent SCOTUS decision that
gave trump broad immunity by ruling that the president is
immune from prosecution for any and all official acts
committed as president, followed by his more recent X
postings “He who saves his Country does not violate any
Law” (not just once, but twice). Trump is emboldened to
ignore the rule of law, which is not unlimited to
blatantly unconstitutional acts (He's already done that
with his refusal to honor the spending bills passed by
congress - essentially implementing line-item vetos
pafter the fact - clearly ruled by SCOTUS as
unconstitutional numerous times.
This is the man(?) that the majority of americans voted
for. So you tell me, do we still have a democracy?
In the immortal and prescient words of Selena Zito from
September of 2016:
“When he makes claims like this, the press takes him
literally, but not seriously; his supporters take him
seriously, but not literally.”
She nailed it.
nope. The recent SCOTUS decision that gave trump broad
immunity by ruling that the president is immune from
prosecution for any and all official acts committed as
president, followed by his more recent X postings “He who
saves his Country does not violate any Law” (not just once,
but twice). Trump is emboldened to ignore the rule of law,
which
is not unlimited to blatantly unconstitutional acts. He's
already done
that with his refusal to honor the spending bills passed by
congress - essentially implementing line-item vetos after
the fact - clearly ruled by SCOTUS as unconstitutional
numerous times.
Oh by the way regarding democracy, hell no! We are a
Constitutional Republic not yet subject to mob rule.
Regarding Constitutional republic, hell no! The judicial and
legislative branches have give tacit approval for the
president to ignore the constitution. If the president can
ignore the constitution, it no longer has any purpose.
On 12 Mar 2025 06:31:29 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 15:46:28 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
cyclintom <cyclintom@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Tue Mar 11 10:58:45 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>>>
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are >>>>>>>>>> horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in >>>>>>>>>>> inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet >>>>>>>>>> found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path. >>>>>>>>>
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion, >>>>>>> shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
I?m assuming this was the Vietnam war or similar which is a kinda difficult
risk case to put it mildly!
And yes there are places where having a gun on you seems a wise decision,
riding your bike even in America doesn?t seems likely hence the absence of
bike specific kit to do so.
Do you suppose that Vietnam or Laos is safe today?
I?d assume so yes, I?d confidently predict it has lower violent crime rate >>>> than US, certainly folks who have gone there or lived there haven?t claimed
they needed a gun or someone with gun for protection!
Roger Merriman
I can't speak for Vietnam or Laos, which are both Communist, but in
Thailand, my nephew - manages a family business in the village -
estimates that every business will have at least one gun (legal or
not) on the premises and all gold shops, for sure, will have one at
the sales counter, and they will shoot.
That is moving goal posts, ie folks are using guns as deterrent against
robbery at high value stores.
And yes guns can be a deterrent, here as the armed police are so lethal,
and using a gun will make you a target both literally and for
investigation, so only very dumb folks use guns as the risks are so high,
and tend to pay the price for doing so.
Thats rather different to having a gun, for bike ride or popping to the
shops and so on.
Roger Merriman
The Europeans, especially the Brits, are much more willing to let
their government run their lives for them than we USAians. The attempt
here to move us in that direction that was soundly rejected in the
last election.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
On 3/12/2025 9:13 AM, Zen Cycle wrote:
On 3/12/2025 9:13 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/12/2025 2:50 AM, zen cycle wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:37 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 09:58:04 -0400, Zen Cycle
<funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 6:47 AM, John B. wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman
<roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people
who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not
carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to
work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've
not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a
bike path.
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will
happen, going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly
safe with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes
having the gun on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did,
on occasion,
shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did
give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
lol...yeah, let's compare an active war zone to a
florida bike path -
that's rational.....
The point was, as I did state, "you felt more secure
"even when they
weren't shooting"
Comparing a bike path in floriduh in 2025 to vietnam in
1970 isn't rational, in fact, it's pretty fucking
stupid....kunich-level stupid.
But as I've said (many times) it is legal in Florida.
You would deny
someone the right to do something that is legal?
nope, if he wants to carry a gun, he's free to do so. His
rationale for carrying one is weak in that the risk of
being attacked on the trail is less than being struck by
lightening, and the idea that a fragile old man with his
admitted deteriorating motor skills, eyesight, and
hearing could actually defend himself without an
assailant taking the gun from him and pistol whipping him
with it is laughable.
But in the immortal words of Mason Williams, "one day you
realize that 'I Want to' is the worlds greatest reason".
Isn't it still a
(sort of) democracy back there?
The fact that there is no linkage between a working
democracy and the "right" to own guns notwithstanding,
the answer to that question is: Sort of, but it's
slipping fast. In 2022 trump stated A Massive Fraud of
this type and magnitude allows for the termination of all
rules, regulations, and articles, even those found in the
Constitution,. Throw in the recent SCOTUS decision that
gave trump broad immunity by ruling that the president is
immune from prosecution for any and all official acts
committed as president, followed by his more recent X
postings He who saves his Country does not violate any
Law (not just once, but twice). Trump is emboldened to
ignore the rule of law, which is not unlimited to
blatantly unconstitutional acts (He's already done that
with his refusal to honor the spending bills passed by
congress - essentially implementing line-item vetos
pafter the fact - clearly ruled by SCOTUS as
unconstitutional numerous times.
This is the man(?) that the majority of americans voted
for. So you tell me, do we still have a democracy?
In the immortal and prescient words of Selena Zito from
September of 2016:
When he makes claims like this, the press takes him
literally, but not seriously; his supporters take him
seriously, but not literally.
She nailed it.
nope. The recent SCOTUS decision that gave trump broad
immunity by ruling that the president is immune from
prosecution for any and all official acts committed as
president, followed by his more recent X postings He who
saves his Country does not violate any Law (not just once,
but twice). Trump is emboldened to ignore the rule of law,
which
is not unlimited to blatantly unconstitutional acts. He's
already done
that with his refusal to honor the spending bills passed by
congress - essentially implementing line-item vetos after
the fact - clearly ruled by SCOTUS as unconstitutional
numerous times.
Oh by the way regarding democracy, hell no! We are a
Constitutional Republic not yet subject to mob rule.
Regarding Constitutional republic, hell no! The judicial and
legislative branches have give tacit approval for the
president to ignore the constitution. If the president can
ignore the constitution, it no longer has any purpose.
The decision is a natural elucidation of prior decisions and
practice. They broke no new ground.
Regarding Presidents ignoring, exceeding or impounding
Congressional appropriations I agree it's not ideal but
every President (not some, each and every) have played on
that field. Some get away with it, some don't, some relent
and some just move on with the issue unresolved.
It would be better for Congress to be explicit and
determinative, but that's not going to happen. Congress for
decades would much prefer to spend time in their home
districts fundraising (a combination of selling policy
positions, shakedowns and outright extortion) than
legislating. Which is why we've come to more delegated
administrative agency rules, enforced by agency judges in
light of agency opinion, than actual Statutes.
As discussed here regularly on various subjects, notably by
Mr Slocumb, writing laws (or Constitutions) is one thing,
but actual enforcement and practice is quite another.
We can agree this is a dog's breakfast and not what it could
be, but Mr Trump is not at all an an outlier in that regard.
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 12 Mar 2025 06:31:29 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 15:46:28 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
cyclintom <cyclintom@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Tue Mar 11 10:58:45 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are >>>>>>>>>>> horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying >>>>>>>>>>> lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in >>>>>>>>>>>> inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet >>>>>>>>>>> found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path. >>>>>>>>>>
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion, >>>>>>>> shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a >>>>>>>> certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
I?m assuming this was the Vietnam war or similar which is a kinda difficult
risk case to put it mildly!
And yes there are places where having a gun on you seems a wise decision,
riding your bike even in America doesn?t seems likely hence the absence of
bike specific kit to do so.
Do you suppose that Vietnam or Laos is safe today?
I?d assume so yes, I?d confidently predict it has lower violent crime rate
than US, certainly folks who have gone there or lived there haven?t claimed
they needed a gun or someone with gun for protection!
Roger Merriman
I can't speak for Vietnam or Laos, which are both Communist, but in
Thailand, my nephew - manages a family business in the village -
estimates that every business will have at least one gun (legal or
not) on the premises and all gold shops, for sure, will have one at
the sales counter, and they will shoot.
That is moving goal posts, ie folks are using guns as deterrent against
robbery at high value stores.
And yes guns can be a deterrent, here as the armed police are so lethal, >>> and using a gun will make you a target both literally and for
investigation, so only very dumb folks use guns as the risks are so high, >>> and tend to pay the price for doing so.
That?s rather different to having a gun, for bike ride or popping to the >>> shops and so on.
Roger Merriman
The Europeans, especially the Brits, are much more willing to let
their government run their lives for them than we USAians. The attempt
here to move us in that direction that was soundly rejected in the
last election.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
Guns as protection or other weapons where used particularly in the era of
the highwaymen but was more seen as tool than a culture, ie when the risk >diminished then it fell out of use and over time became regulated.
Roger Merriman
On 3/12/2025 12:56 PM, cyclintom wrote:
So YOU feel the need to make those decisions for others. Insanely fearful is the word for that.
I'm not trying to make a decision for our tricycle rider. I'm just
pointing out that some decisions are based on phobias, and those
decisions are foolish.
--
- Frank Krygowski
On 3/12/2025 9:05 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/11/2025 9:29 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
"...helmets have not killed any innocent bystanders."
Nor has Mr Tricycle. Score 0-0.
You switched the comparison from devices to people. IOW, you're
comparing apples to hand grenades.
Compare devices to devices: Bike helmets, silly as they usually are,
have not been used to murder other people. Guns are regularly used to
murder others.
Or compare people to people. Those wearing bike helmets don't intend to
use them to harm other people. Those carrying guns do intend to
seriously harm others, if in their instantaneous and often distorted >judgment, those people deserve to be seriously harmed. Why else would
they carry a lethal device?
:...law calling for serious training and re-certification of gun owners"
Actually, much time and expense for a couple hundred years have been
spent by service organizations (NRA, GOA), schools, Scouts, quasi-
governmental programs (CMP) etc on firearms operation, safety protocols
and marksmanship. To good effect I might add.
Indeed, and I strongly approve of firearm training for those intent on
using or having guns. (Both of our kids got such training, BTW.) But
again, you're moving the goalposts. The question was whether that
training should be required by law. And you _know_ that NRA and GOA
would have armies of lawyers fighting against any such law. Hell, it
would hurt gun sales!
On 3/12/2025 3:22 AM, John B. wrote:
Why should someone be condemned for doing something that is
perfectly legal?
Because something can be legal yet foolish. Examples abound.
On 3/12/2025 11:31 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/12/2025 9:13 AM, Zen Cycle wrote:
On 3/12/2025 9:13 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/12/2025 2:50 AM, zen cycle wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:37 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 09:58:04 -0400, Zen Cycle
<funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 6:47 AM, John B. wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman
<roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their
own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know
people who are
horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes,
honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not
carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train
to work in
inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC
you've not yet
found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike
paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on
a bike path.
Just because it can happen doesn’t mean it will
happen, going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly
safe with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes
having the gun on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people
did, on occasion,
shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did
give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
lol...yeah, let's compare an active war zone to a
florida bike path -
that's rational.....
The point was, as I did state, "you felt more secure
"even when they
weren't shooting"
Comparing a bike path in floriduh in 2025 to vietnam in
1970 isn't rational, in fact, it's pretty fucking
stupid....kunich-level stupid.
But as I've said (many times) it is legal in Florida.
You would deny
someone the right to do something that is legal?
nope, if he wants to carry a gun, he's free to do so.
His rationale for carrying one is weak in that the risk
of being attacked on the trail is less than being
struck by lightening, and the idea that a fragile old
man with his admitted deteriorating motor skills,
eyesight, and hearing could actually defend himself
without an assailant taking the gun from him and pistol
whipping him with it is laughable.
But in the immortal words of Mason Williams, "one day
you realize that 'I Want to' is the worlds greatest
reason".
Isn't it still a
(sort of) democracy back there?
The fact that there is no linkage between a working
democracy and the "right" to own guns notwithstanding,
the answer to that question is: Sort of, but it's
slipping fast. In 2022 trump stated “A Massive Fraud of
this type and magnitude allows for the termination of
all rules, regulations, and articles, even those found
in the Constitution,”. Throw in the recent SCOTUS
decision that gave trump broad immunity by ruling that
the president is immune from prosecution for any and
all official acts committed as president, followed by
his more recent X postings “He who saves his Country
does not violate any Law” (not just once, but twice).
Trump is emboldened to ignore the rule of law, which is
not unlimited to blatantly unconstitutional acts (He's
already done that with his refusal to honor the
spending bills passed by congress - essentially
implementing line-item vetos pafter the fact - clearly
ruled by SCOTUS as unconstitutional numerous times.
This is the man(?) that the majority of americans voted
for. So you tell me, do we still have a democracy?
In the immortal and prescient words of Selena Zito from
September of 2016:
“When he makes claims like this, the press takes him
literally, but not seriously; his supporters take him
seriously, but not literally.”
She nailed it.
nope. The recent SCOTUS decision that gave trump broad
immunity by ruling that the president is immune from
prosecution for any and all official acts committed as
president, followed by his more recent X postings “He who
saves his Country does not violate any Law” (not just
once, but twice). Trump is emboldened to ignore the rule
of law, which
is not unlimited to blatantly unconstitutional acts. He's
already done
that with his refusal to honor the spending bills passed
by congress - essentially implementing line-item vetos
after the fact - clearly ruled by SCOTUS as
unconstitutional numerous times.
Oh by the way regarding democracy, hell no! We are a
Constitutional Republic not yet subject to mob rule.
Regarding Constitutional republic, hell no! The judicial
and legislative branches have give tacit approval for the
president to ignore the constitution. If the president
can ignore the constitution, it no longer has any purpose.
The decision is a natural elucidation of prior decisions
and practice. They broke no new ground.
Regarding Presidents ignoring, exceeding or impounding
Congressional appropriations I agree it's not ideal but
every President (not some, each and every) have played on
that field. Some get away with it, some don't, some relent
and some just move on with the issue unresolved.
It would be better for Congress to be explicit and
determinative, but that's not going to happen. Congress
for decades would much prefer to spend time in their home
districts fundraising (a combination of selling policy
positions, shakedowns and outright extortion) than
legislating. Which is why we've come to more delegated
administrative agency rules, enforced by agency judges in
light of agency opinion, than actual Statutes.
As discussed here regularly on various subjects, notably
by Mr Slocumb, writing laws (or Constitutions) is one
thing, but actual enforcement and practice is quite another.
We can agree this is a dog's breakfast and not what it
could be, but Mr Trump is not at all an an outlier in that
regard.
That's a very unusual opinion.
On 3/12/2025 8:46 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/11/2025 9:15 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/11/2025 9:08 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/11/2025 5:23 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Just because it can happen doesn’t mean it will happen,
going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly
safe with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
Which is a personal risk assessment. His, not yours.
And as I must frequently remind people, personal
assessments can be flat out wrong. With phobias, they
almost always are.
Consider the evidence on this one. It sounds like he's
taken his gun on every bike ride for many years. That's
probably hundreds of trips. Surely if he had actually had
to brandish it, let alone shoot it, he'd have told us by
now.
So his hundreds personal risk assessments saying "I might
need my gun for defense today" have all proven wrong.
He's never once been right on this!
That's a uniformly crappy track record.
We have a fire extinguisher in the shop truck and three of
them in the bike shop (with 53 years of annual inspection
fees I might add). I have never used one. Ever.
Think benefits vs. detriments, please.
Fire extinguishers are benign. We don't have tens of
thousands of fire extinguisher deaths per year. One thug
beat capitol police with a fire extinguisher on January 6,
2021, but that idiot was an extreme outlier, whom Trump
tried to turn into a hero.
(So much for complaints about criminals going free, eh?)
On 3/12/2025 9:05 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/11/2025 9:29 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
"...helmets have not killed any innocent bystanders."
Nor has Mr Tricycle. Score 0-0.
You switched the comparison from devices to people. IOW,
you're comparing apples to hand grenades.
Compare devices to devices: Bike helmets, silly as they
usually are, have not been used to murder other people. Guns
are regularly used to murder others.
Or compare people to people. Those wearing bike helmets
don't intend to use them to harm other people. Those
carrying guns do intend to seriously harm others, if in
their instantaneous and often distorted judgment, those
people deserve to be seriously harmed. Why else would they
carry a lethal device?
:...law calling for serious training and re-certification
of gun owners"
Actually, much time and expense for a couple hundred years
have been spent by service organizations (NRA, GOA),
schools, Scouts, quasi- governmental programs (CMP) etc on
firearms operation, safety protocols and marksmanship. To
good effect I might add.
Indeed, and I strongly approve of firearm training for those
intent on using or having guns. (Both of our kids got such
training, BTW.) But again, you're moving the goalposts. The
question was whether that training should be required by
law. And you _know_ that NRA and GOA would have armies of
lawyers fighting against any such law. Hell, it would hurt
gun sales!
On 3/12/2025 3:22 AM, John B. wrote:
Why should someone be condemned for doing something that is
perfectly legal?
Because something can be legal yet foolish. Examples abound.
On 3/12/2025 11:40 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/12/2025 9:36 AM, Zen Cycle wrote:
On 3/12/2025 9:22 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/12/2025 3:19 AM, zen cycle wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle
<funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American
fetish for firearms, and
the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn
for paranoia so
severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm
to do ordinary
things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car,
fill a gas tank, etc.
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some
phobias. Not this one.
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist.
One classmate of
mine in an adult education class brought his
handgun to a class picnic
in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy
paranoia. Another guy,
less admirable in general, bragged to me about
carrying his handgun
into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute
stupidity, and crazy
paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese
that he used a special
stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly.
Maybe his physical
shortcomings triggered feelings of great
vulnerability, as with Mr.
Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off
the charts crazy -
as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable
certain that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never
experienced a deranged madman
shooting into a crown before, and most probably
never will again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-
citizen- landed-8-
of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15-
seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying
only days after the
Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without
preparation is
excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some
diligence and range
time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for
personal protection and
never take the time and diligence. If there was a law
requiring range
time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more
confident in the
general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like
this are far more
prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-
and- kills- mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend
committed an illegal
act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about
a legal act.
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
not much. The gun fetishists (lobby) thinks any
restrictions on gun ownership are unconstitutional. In
their (small) minds, the boyfriend did nothing wrong.
Besides, there's this:
https://www.fox13news.com/news/parents-4-year-old-boy-
who- accidentally-shot-killed-himself-will-not-be-
charged- davenport-police
The child found the gun underneath the seat underneath
the seat accidentally shot himself. No laws were
broken. In floriduh, HB 1087 was introduced that would
have required owners to lock their firearms in a trunk
or glove box when left inside an unoccupied car. It
died in committe.
Then there's this:
https://nypost.com/2024/08/26/us-news/5-year-old-utah-
boy- dies- after- shooting-himself-with-parents-gun/
Again, no laws were broken, there is no Utah law
against leaving unattended weapons accessible to
minors, and also does not require weapons to be secured.
Your fellow citizens enacted Massachusetts statutes
apparently of a different nature than in Utah:
https://www.mass.gov/doc/7630-improper-storage-of-a-
firearm-gl- c-140- s-131l/download
I'm fully aware of current massachusetts firearms laws,
thank you, having completed the state mandated LTC
earlier this year (license on the way).
Utah may revise theirs (or enforce them more rigorously.
I don't actually know). Or not.
I'm going with 'not'.
And with no possibility of exacting any sanctions of any
I doubt you and I have any disagreement that it was
criminal negligence in a practical and moral sense.
types on the parents, by what motivation is there to hope
future gun owners will be any more responsible?
https://abcnews.go.com/US/father-christopher-bizilj-died-
firing-uzi- urged-son/story?id=12565132
The live-firing of automatic weapons was being supervised
by a 15 - year old, The promotional advertisment for the
event said "It's all legal & fun — No permits or licenses
required!!!!"
The parent was not charged, the organizers were
acquitted, in gun- hating liberal massachusetts.
I didn't know the case but sometimes jurors pause to
reflect on the multiple prior felons with stolen firearms
threatening, maiming or killing the citizenry who are
charged by the District Attorney with disorderly conduct
and/or similar lightweight charges. They react in a very
human way.
Is that right? No. Understandable? Yes.
Is the kid's death no problem? Apparently.
On 3/12/2025 9:13 AM, Zen Cycle wrote:
On 3/12/2025 9:13 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/12/2025 2:50 AM, zen cycle wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:37 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 09:58:04 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com> >>>>> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 6:47 AM, John B. wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com>
wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own
behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are >>>>>>>>>> horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying
lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in >>>>>>>>>>> inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet >>>>>>>>>> found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path. >>>>>>>>>
Just because it can happen doesn’t mean it will happen, going >>>>>>>> out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or >>>>>>>> without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun >>>>>>>> on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion, >>>>>>> shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a
certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
lol...yeah, let's compare an active war zone to a florida bike path - >>>>>> that's rational.....
The point was, as I did state, "you felt more secure "even when they >>>>> weren't shooting"
Comparing a bike path in floriduh in 2025 to vietnam in 1970 isn't
rational, in fact, it's pretty fucking stupid....kunich-level stupid.
But as I've said (many times) it is legal in Florida. You would deny >>>>> someone the right to do something that is legal?
nope, if he wants to carry a gun, he's free to do so. His rationale
for carrying one is weak in that the risk of being attacked on the
trail is less than being struck by lightening, and the idea that a
fragile old man with his admitted deteriorating motor skills,
eyesight, and hearing could actually defend himself without an
assailant taking the gun from him and pistol whipping him with it is
laughable.
But in the immortal words of Mason Williams, "one day you realize
that 'I Want to' is the worlds greatest reason".
Isn't it still a
(sort of) democracy back there?
The fact that there is no linkage between a working democracy and
the "right" to own guns notwithstanding, the answer to that question
is: Sort of, but it's slipping fast. In 2022 trump stated “A Massive >>>> Fraud of this type and magnitude allows for the termination of all
rules, regulations, and articles, even those found in the
Constitution,”. Throw in the recent SCOTUS decision that gave trump
broad immunity by ruling that the president is immune from
prosecution for any and all official acts committed as president,
followed by his more recent X postings “He who saves his Country
does not violate any Law” (not just once, but twice). Trump is
emboldened to ignore the rule of law, which is not unlimited to
blatantly unconstitutional acts (He's already done that with his
refusal to honor the spending bills passed by congress - essentially
implementing line-item vetos pafter the fact - clearly ruled by
SCOTUS as unconstitutional numerous times.
This is the man(?) that the majority of americans voted for. So you
tell me, do we still have a democracy?
In the immortal and prescient words of Selena Zito from September of
2016:
“When he makes claims like this, the press takes him literally, but
not seriously; his supporters take him seriously, but not literally.”
She nailed it.
nope. The recent SCOTUS decision that gave trump broad immunity by
ruling that the president is immune from prosecution for any and all
official acts committed as president, followed by his more recent X
postings “He who saves his Country does not violate any Law” (not just >> once, but twice). Trump is emboldened to ignore the rule of law, which
is not unlimited to blatantly unconstitutional acts. He's already done
that with his refusal to honor the spending bills passed by congress -
essentially implementing line-item vetos after the fact - clearly
ruled by SCOTUS as unconstitutional numerous times.
Oh by the way regarding democracy, hell no! We are a Constitutional
Republic not yet subject to mob rule.
Regarding Constitutional republic, hell no! The judicial and
legislative branches have give tacit approval for the president to
ignore the constitution. If the president can ignore the constitution,
it no longer has any purpose.
sorta OT but I think you'd enjoy this latest from Babylon Bee:
https://nypost.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2025/03/trump-amy-coney- barrett-100283520.jpg?resize=1536,1418&quality=75&strip=all
On Tue Mar 11 11:50:20 2025 Zen Cycle wrote:
On 3/11/2025 11:38 AM, cyclintom wrote:
Your pal Obama turned up in San Francisco, He has some friends in the Castro that he came to visit. Michelle got tired of the pretend game and is off on her own now and you haven;t heard a word about those pretend children.
You are the biggest tool, fool, and idiot I've ever seen.
https://www.vanityfair.com/style/story/obama-divorce-aniston-conspiracy-theory
Vanity Fair huh, That's is where all of you queers get your information.
That is, whewn you're not quoting the New York Slimes word for word.
On 12 Mar 2025 17:00:23 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 12 Mar 2025 06:31:29 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 15:46:28 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>
cyclintom <cyclintom@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Tue Mar 11 10:58:45 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own >>>>>>>>>>>>> behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are >>>>>>>>>>>> horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying >>>>>>>>>>>> lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in >>>>>>>>>>>>> inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet >>>>>>>>>>>> found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path. >>>>>>>>>>>
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion, >>>>>>>>> shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a >>>>>>>>> certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
I?m assuming this was the Vietnam war or similar which is a kinda difficult
risk case to put it mildly!
And yes there are places where having a gun on you seems a wise decision,
riding your bike even in America doesn?t seems likely hence the absence of
bike specific kit to do so.
Do you suppose that Vietnam or Laos is safe today?
I?d assume so yes, I?d confidently predict it has lower violent crime rate
than US, certainly folks who have gone there or lived there haven?t claimed
they needed a gun or someone with gun for protection!
Roger Merriman
I can't speak for Vietnam or Laos, which are both Communist, but in >>>>> Thailand, my nephew - manages a family business in the village -
estimates that every business will have at least one gun (legal or
not) on the premises and all gold shops, for sure, will have one at
the sales counter, and they will shoot.
That is moving goal posts, ie folks are using guns as deterrent against >>>> robbery at high value stores.
And yes guns can be a deterrent, here as the armed police are so lethal, >>>> and using a gun will make you a target both literally and for
investigation, so only very dumb folks use guns as the risks are so high, >>>> and tend to pay the price for doing so.
That?s rather different to having a gun, for bike ride or popping to the >>>> shops and so on.
Roger Merriman
The Europeans, especially the Brits, are much more willing to let
their government run their lives for them than we USAians. The attempt
here to move us in that direction that was soundly rejected in the
last election.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
Guns as protection or other weapons where used particularly in the era of
the highwaymen but was more seen as tool than a culture, ie when the risk
diminished then it fell out of use and over time became regulated.
Roger Merriman
From what I understand, in the UK, guns were regulated out of
existance by the government.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 13:59:56 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/12/2025 3:22 AM, John B. wrote:
Why should someone be condemned for doing something that is
perfectly legal?
Because something can be legal yet foolish. Examples abound.
Sure, but who makes the decision? The guy that gets to do the deed? Or >someone sitting at home a thousand, or more, miles away with no actual >knowledge of conditions or circumstances at the site?
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 12 Mar 2025 17:00:23 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 12 Mar 2025 06:31:29 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 15:46:28 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>>
cyclintom <cyclintom@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Tue Mar 11 10:58:45 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own >>>>>>>>>>>>>> behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are >>>>>>>>>>>>> horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees, >>>>>>>>>>>>> graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying >>>>>>>>>>>>> lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in >>>>>>>>>>>>>> inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet >>>>>>>>>>>>> found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in >>>>>>>>>>>>> suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path. >>>>>>>>>>>>
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion, >>>>>>>>>> shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a >>>>>>>>>> certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
I?m assuming this was the Vietnam war or similar which is a kinda difficult
risk case to put it mildly!
And yes there are places where having a gun on you seems a wise decision,
riding your bike even in America doesn?t seems likely hence the absence of
bike specific kit to do so.
Do you suppose that Vietnam or Laos is safe today?
I?d assume so yes, I?d confidently predict it has lower violent crime rate
than US, certainly folks who have gone there or lived there haven?t claimed
they needed a gun or someone with gun for protection!
Roger Merriman
I can't speak for Vietnam or Laos, which are both Communist, but in >>>>>> Thailand, my nephew - manages a family business in the village -
estimates that every business will have at least one gun (legal or >>>>>> not) on the premises and all gold shops, for sure, will have one at >>>>>> the sales counter, and they will shoot.
That is moving goal posts, ie folks are using guns as deterrent against >>>>> robbery at high value stores.
And yes guns can be a deterrent, here as the armed police are so lethal, >>>>> and using a gun will make you a target both literally and for
investigation, so only very dumb folks use guns as the risks are so high, >>>>> and tend to pay the price for doing so.
That?s rather different to having a gun, for bike ride or popping to the >>>>> shops and so on.
Roger Merriman
The Europeans, especially the Brits, are much more willing to let
their government run their lives for them than we USAians. The attempt >>>> here to move us in that direction that was soundly rejected in the
last election.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
Guns as protection or other weapons where used particularly in the era of >>> the highwaymen but was more seen as tool than a culture, ie when the risk >>> diminished then it fell out of use and over time became regulated.
Roger Merriman
From what I understand, in the UK, guns were regulated out of
existance by the government.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
Folks who have a need or want, ie farmers/hunters/target shooters
absolutely own guns, generally rifles/shot guns. Handguns bar target
shooters arent legal but then hardly useful for farmers/hunters either so.
Roger Merriman
On 3/12/2025 8:39 PM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 08:05:33 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
In the same way that red light running cyclists or the
meandering idiots in and out of a lane or the wrong-way
cyclists all drive me nuts, I very much agree that firearm
ineptitude/fecklessness/reckless disregard is a real problem.
Which is a matter of practical implementation not of
principle itself.
Right. Try enacting a law calling for serious training and
re-certification of gun owners. See what the NRA and GOA say
about that. "Hell no, we have a constitutional right to be
incompetent!"
Yet another example of someone talking about something he knows
nothing about:
"According to available information, states that typically require
proof of training before issuing a gun license include: California,
Connecticut, Hawaii, Maryland, Massachusetts, New Jersey, New York,
Washington, and the District of Columbia; these states often mandate
completion of a firearm safety course to obtain a license to carry a
concealed weapon"
Sorry, John. In Ohio there's no "serious training" needed to buy a gun.
A person may have to pass a background check - say, to show he hasn't
already been convicted of beating his wife - but that's far from the
same thing.
Some states may require a tiny bit of multiple choice testing, but
that's not "serious training" either. California's "Firearm Safety Certificate" (FSC) requires getting 75% on a written test after reading
this booklet: https://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/agweb/pdfs/firearms/forms/hscsg.pdf Counting that as "serious training" is like calling Tom's "reading out
three libraries" the same as an engineering degree.
And note that carrying a concealed weapon - in your paragraph - is much different than just owning a gun, which is what I was talking about.
If there is a state that requires actual serious training before owning
a gun, I haven't heard of it.
On 13 Mar 2025 00:25:27 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 12 Mar 2025 17:00:23 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 12 Mar 2025 06:31:29 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 15:46:28 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>>>
cyclintom <cyclintom@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Tue Mar 11 10:58:45 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are >>>>>>>>>>>>>> horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees, >>>>>>>>>>>>>> graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying >>>>>>>>>>>>>> lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet >>>>>>>>>>>>>> found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in >>>>>>>>>>>>>> suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path. >>>>>>>>>>>>>
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion, >>>>>>>>>>> shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a >>>>>>>>>>> certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
I?m assuming this was the Vietnam war or similar which is a kinda difficult
risk case to put it mildly!
And yes there are places where having a gun on you seems a wise decision,
riding your bike even in America doesn?t seems likely hence the absence of
bike specific kit to do so.
Do you suppose that Vietnam or Laos is safe today?
I?d assume so yes, I?d confidently predict it has lower violent crime rate
than US, certainly folks who have gone there or lived there haven?t claimed
they needed a gun or someone with gun for protection!
Roger Merriman
I can't speak for Vietnam or Laos, which are both Communist, but in >>>>>>> Thailand, my nephew - manages a family business in the village - >>>>>>> estimates that every business will have at least one gun (legal or >>>>>>> not) on the premises and all gold shops, for sure, will have one at >>>>>>> the sales counter, and they will shoot.
That is moving goal posts, ie folks are using guns as deterrent against >>>>>> robbery at high value stores.
And yes guns can be a deterrent, here as the armed police are so lethal, >>>>>> and using a gun will make you a target both literally and for
investigation, so only very dumb folks use guns as the risks are so high,
and tend to pay the price for doing so.
That?s rather different to having a gun, for bike ride or popping to the >>>>>> shops and so on.
Roger Merriman
The Europeans, especially the Brits, are much more willing to let
their government run their lives for them than we USAians. The attempt >>>>> here to move us in that direction that was soundly rejected in the
last election.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
Guns as protection or other weapons where used particularly in the era of >>>> the highwaymen but was more seen as tool than a culture, ie when the risk >>>> diminished then it fell out of use and over time became regulated.
Roger Merriman
From what I understand, in the UK, guns were regulated out of
existance by the government.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
Folks who have a need or want, ie farmers/hunters/target shooters
absolutely own guns, generally rifles/shot guns. Handguns bar target
shooters arent legal but then hardly useful for farmers/hunters either so. >>
Roger Merriman
So, only criminals have handguns. It's good that you don't have as
many thugs, crooks, and gangs as the USA.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
https://www.flickr.com/photos/16972296@N08/with/28633520961On 13 Mar 2025 10:23:01 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 13 Mar 2025 00:25:27 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 12 Mar 2025 17:00:23 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 12 Mar 2025 06:31:29 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>>
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 15:46:28 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>
cyclintom <cyclintom@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Tue Mar 11 10:58:45 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the gun on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion, >>>>>>>>>>>> shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a >>>>>>>>>>>> certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
I?m assuming this was the Vietnam war or similar which is a kinda difficult
risk case to put it mildly!
And yes there are places where having a gun on you seems a wise decision,
riding your bike even in America doesn?t seems likely hence the absence of
bike specific kit to do so.
Do you suppose that Vietnam or Laos is safe today?
I?d assume so yes, I?d confidently predict it has lower violent crime rate
than US, certainly folks who have gone there or lived there haven?t claimed
they needed a gun or someone with gun for protection!
Roger Merriman
I can't speak for Vietnam or Laos, which are both Communist, but in >>>>>>>> Thailand, my nephew - manages a family business in the village - >>>>>>>> estimates that every business will have at least one gun (legal or >>>>>>>> not) on the premises and all gold shops, for sure, will have one at >>>>>>>> the sales counter, and they will shoot.
That is moving goal posts, ie folks are using guns as deterrent against >>>>>>> robbery at high value stores.
And yes guns can be a deterrent, here as the armed police are so lethal,
and using a gun will make you a target both literally and for
investigation, so only very dumb folks use guns as the risks are so high,
and tend to pay the price for doing so.
That?s rather different to having a gun, for bike ride or popping to the
shops and so on.
Roger Merriman
The Europeans, especially the Brits, are much more willing to let
their government run their lives for them than we USAians. The attempt >>>>>> here to move us in that direction that was soundly rejected in the >>>>>> last election.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
Guns as protection or other weapons where used particularly in the era of >>>>> the highwaymen but was more seen as tool than a culture, ie when the risk >>>>> diminished then it fell out of use and over time became regulated.
Roger Merriman
From what I understand, in the UK, guns were regulated out of
existance by the government.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
Folks who have a need or want, ie farmers/hunters/target shooters
absolutely own guns, generally rifles/shot guns. Handguns bar target
shooters aren?t legal but then hardly useful for farmers/hunters either so. >>>
Roger Merriman
So, only criminals have handguns. It's good that you don't have as
many thugs, crooks, and gangs as the USA.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
Career criminals absolutely could get hold of guns Im sure, but due to the >response by the Police in that the firearms officers will be called, and >these guys are deadly serious and if your remotely pose a threat you will
be killed.
If youre gone before the police arrive youre now made yourself high >priority for investigation and arrest purely by dint of your firearms use >within what ever crime.
You can expect no bail from the courts as youve proven that you are a
risk, and likewise a long prison term.
Hence the organised and career criminals keep clear of guns as they arent >worth the risk.
And why its very rare for guns to be used, and tends to end badly for
them.
Roger Merriman
On 3/12/2025 9:41 PM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 13:18:46 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
... "lawful" is not the same as "smart" or "wise." In
this case, I think
it's foolish; and we are allowed to discuss such
foolishness.
Why would you deny us the right to discuss it?
What's to object? The bloke is acting within the law ...
And I am acting within the law when I discuss his timidity.
Why are you objecting?
On 3/13/2025 10:20 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/12/2025 9:41 PM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 13:18:46 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
... "lawful" is not the same as "smart" or "wise." In
this case, I think
it's foolish; and we are allowed to discuss such
foolishness.
Why would you deny us the right to discuss it?
What's to object? The bloke is acting within the law ...
And I am acting within the law when I discuss his timidity.
Why are you objecting?
I, for one, and a free speech & 1st Amendment kinda guy.
Knock yourself out, I'm OK with divergent opinion as it's a
positive feature of a free society.
floriduh dumbass <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:I can't imagine what it must be like to go through life so willfully
On 12 Mar 2025 17:00:23 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Guns as protection or other weapons where used particularly in the era of >>> the highwaymen but was more seen as tool than a culture, ie when the risk >>> diminished then it fell out of use and over time became regulated.
Roger Merriman
From what I understand, in the UK, guns were regulated out of
existance by the government.
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 08:20:42 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/12/2025 5:32 AM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 04:19:11 -0400, zen cycle
<funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com> >>>>> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish for firearms, and >>>>>>>> the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for paranoia so >>>>>>>> severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to do ordinary >>>>>>>> things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill a gas tank, etc. >>>>>>>>
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias. Not this one. >>>>>>>>
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist. One classmate of >>>>>>>> mine in an adult education class brought his handgun to a class picnic >>>>>>>> in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy paranoia. Another guy, >>>>>>>> less admirable in general, bragged to me about carrying his handgun >>>>>>>> into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute stupidity, and crazy >>>>>>>> paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that he used a special >>>>>>>> stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly. Maybe his physical >>>>>>>> shortcomings triggered feelings of great vulnerability, as with Mr. >>>>>>>> Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off the charts crazy - >>>>>>>> as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced a deranged madman
shooting into a crown before, and most probably never will again. >>>>>>>
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-citizen-landed-8- >>>>>>> of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15-seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying only days after the >>>>>>> Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without preparation is
excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some diligence and range >>>>>>> time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for personal protection and >>>>>> never take the time and diligence. If there was a law requiring range >>>>>> time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more confident in the >>>>>> general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like this are far more >>>>>> prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-and-kills-mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend committed an illegal
act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about a legal act.
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
not much. The gun fetishists (lobby) thinks any restrictions on gun
ownership are unconstitutional. In their (small) minds, the boyfriend
did nothing wrong.
Re restrictions on gun ownership???
The first piece of national gun control legislation was passed on June
26, 1934. The National Firearms Act (NFA)
Which is not germane to the point that the gun fetishists (lobby) think
any restrictions on gun ownership are unconstitutional.
Really? Is the NRA advocating fully automatic weapons, extremely
short barrel rifles, etc., that the NFA bans?
On 3/12/2025 11:02 PM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 14:25:04 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/12/2025 2:21 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/12/2025 12:32 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/12/2025 8:46 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/11/2025 9:15 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/11/2025 9:08 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/11/2025 5:23 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Just because it can happen doesn’t mean it will happen, going out >>>>>>>>> on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or >>>>>>>>> without
carrying any guns on his rides.
Which is a personal risk assessment. His, not yours.
And as I must frequently remind people, personal assessments can be >>>>>>> flat out wrong. With phobias, they almost always are.
Consider the evidence on this one. It sounds like he's taken his gun >>>>>>> on every bike ride for many years. That's probably hundreds of
trips. Surely if he had actually had to brandish it, let alone shoot >>>>>>> it, he'd have told us by now.
So his hundreds personal risk assessments saying "I might need my >>>>>>> gun for defense today" have all proven wrong. He's never once been >>>>>>> right on this!
That's a uniformly crappy track record.
We have a fire extinguisher in the shop truck and three of them in >>>>>> the bike shop (with 53 years of annual inspection fees I might add). >>>>>> I have never used one. Ever.
Think benefits vs. detriments, please.
Fire extinguishers are benign. We don't have tens of thousands of fire >>>>> extinguisher deaths per year. One thug beat capitol police with a fire >>>>> extinguisher on January 6, 2021, but that idiot was an extreme
outlier, whom Trump tried to turn into a hero.
(So much for complaints about criminals going free, eh?)
Difficult mix of cases but they all did time, and hard time at that.
As do many parolees. Still there are complaints from those who would
have them rot in jail forever.
Weren't you the guy that was quoting percentages just a bit ago?
"About 69% of parolees in a 1978 study were rearrested for a serious
crime within six years of their release. Recidivism rates vary
depending on the type of crime, demographics, and length of time since
release.
Recidivism rates by crime type
Property crimes: Have the highest recidivism rates, with estimates
of 78.3% of people convicted of property crimes being rearrested over
five years
Drug offenses: Over 80% of convicted drug offenders are arrested
again within nine years
Recidivism rates by demographics
First arrested before age 18: Have the highest recidivism rates
First arrested at age 40 or older: Have the lowest recidivism
rates, below 30%
Recidivism rates by time since release
Recidivism rates are highest in the first two years after release
In a 2021 study, 66% of people released from prison in 24
different states in 2008 were re-arrested within three years
Other parole and probation statistics
45% of state prison admissions are the result of violations of
probation or parole
The severity of the original conviction offense is not the only
factor that predicts recidivism risk
How common is it for released prisoners to re-offend?
May 14, 2566 BE
USAFacts
Recidivism of Young Parolees - Bureau of Justice Statistics
Approximately 69% of a group of young parolees were rearrested for
a serious crime within 6 years of their release from prison, 53...
Bureau of Justice Statistics
New National Recidivism Report - Council on Criminal Justice"
You seem to be saying criminals should remain in prison, because those released will likely re-offend.
So will you complain about Trump releasing those who were convicted of attacking police officers at the capitol, after being caught doing so on video?
On 3/12/2025 5:31 AM, John B. wrote:
But again, it is legal and even recommended by at least one high level
police officer. Who are you, or Frankie, for that matter, to deny some
one the right to do something that is lawful to do?
<sigh> John, you're among those who seem to forget this is a
_discussion_ group.
I'm not denying our timid friend's right to carry his security gun with
him, any more than I'm denying someone's right to carry a security
blanket or security teddy bear. After all, the motivation is the same
for all three, and all three are generally lawful.
But "lawful" is not the same as "smart" or "wise." In this case, I think
it's foolish; and we are allowed to discuss such foolishness.
Why would you deny us the right to discuss it?
On 3/12/2025 11:02 PM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 14:25:04 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/12/2025 2:21 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/12/2025 12:32 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/12/2025 8:46 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/11/2025 9:15 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/11/2025 9:08 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/11/2025 5:23 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going out >>>>>>>>> on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or >>>>>>>>> without
carrying any guns on his rides.
Which is a personal risk assessment. His, not yours.
And as I must frequently remind people, personal assessments can be >>>>>>> flat out wrong. With phobias, they almost always are.
Consider the evidence on this one. It sounds like he's taken his gun >>>>>>> on every bike ride for many years. That's probably hundreds of
trips. Surely if he had actually had to brandish it, let alone shoot >>>>>>> it, he'd have told us by now.
So his hundreds personal risk assessments saying "I might need my >>>>>>> gun for defense today" have all proven wrong. He's never once been >>>>>>> right on this!
That's a uniformly crappy track record.
We have a fire extinguisher in the shop truck and three of them in >>>>>> the bike shop (with 53 years of annual inspection fees I might add). >>>>>> I have never used one. Ever.
Think benefits vs. detriments, please.
Fire extinguishers are benign. We don't have tens of thousands of fire >>>>> extinguisher deaths per year. One thug beat capitol police with a fire >>>>> extinguisher on January 6, 2021, but that idiot was an extreme
outlier, whom Trump tried to turn into a hero.
(So much for complaints about criminals going free, eh?)
Difficult mix of cases but they all did time, and hard time at that.
As do many parolees. Still there are complaints from those who would
have them rot in jail forever.
Weren't you the guy that was quoting percentages just a bit ago?
"About 69% of parolees in a 1978 study were rearrested for a serious
crime within six years of their release. Recidivism rates vary
depending on the type of crime, demographics, and length of time since
release.
Recidivism rates by crime type
Property crimes: Have the highest recidivism rates, with estimates
of 78.3% of people convicted of property crimes being rearrested over
five years
Drug offenses: Over 80% of convicted drug offenders are arrested
again within nine years
Recidivism rates by demographics
First arrested before age 18: Have the highest recidivism rates
First arrested at age 40 or older: Have the lowest recidivism
rates, below 30%
Recidivism rates by time since release
Recidivism rates are highest in the first two years after release
In a 2021 study, 66% of people released from prison in 24
different states in 2008 were re-arrested within three years
Other parole and probation statistics
45% of state prison admissions are the result of violations of
probation or parole
The severity of the original conviction offense is not the only
factor that predicts recidivism risk
How common is it for released prisoners to re-offend?
May 14, 2566 BE
USAFacts
Recidivism of Young Parolees - Bureau of Justice Statistics
Approximately 69% of a group of young parolees were rearrested for
a serious crime within 6 years of their release from prison, 53...
Bureau of Justice Statistics
New National Recidivism Report - Council on Criminal Justice"
You seem to be saying criminals should remain in prison, because those >released will likely re-offend.
So will you complain about Trump releasing those who were convicted of >attacking police officers at the capitol, after being caught doing so on >video?
I have carried a pocket knife since I was a child. Never
sliced or stabbed anyone but yet I carry it anyway.
On 3/13/2025 7:40 PM, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 13 Mar 2025 11:26:15 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
You seem to be saying criminals should remain in prison, because those
released will likely re-offend.
So will you complain about Trump releasing those who were convicted of
attacking police officers at the capitol, after being caught doing so on >>> video?
No comments - I don't live there and thus know little about what goes
on there... just as you and Florida.
:-) How funny! You don't live in the United States, yet you post
endless opinions on what goes on here!
And just imagine: What if the world had some sort of system of
interconnected computers with access to knowledge? If that only existed,
a person might be able to use it for research, and find real data on
what goes on in different places! Wouldn't that be useful? There would
be so much less ignorance!
Oh, wait... ;-)
On Thu, 13 Mar 2025 19:48:55 -0400, Catrike Ryder
<Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On Thu, 13 Mar 2025 11:26:15 -0400, Frank Krygowski >><frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/12/2025 11:02 PM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 14:25:04 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/12/2025 2:21 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/12/2025 12:32 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:As do many parolees. Still there are complaints from those who would >>>>> have them rot in jail forever.
On 3/12/2025 8:46 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/11/2025 9:15 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/11/2025 9:08 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/11/2025 5:23 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going out >>>>>>>>>>> on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe with or >>>>>>>>>>> without
carrying any guns on his rides.
Which is a personal risk assessment. His, not yours.
And as I must frequently remind people, personal assessments can be >>>>>>>>> flat out wrong. With phobias, they almost always are.
Consider the evidence on this one. It sounds like he's taken his gun >>>>>>>>> on every bike ride for many years. That's probably hundreds of >>>>>>>>> trips. Surely if he had actually had to brandish it, let alone shoot >>>>>>>>> it, he'd have told us by now.
So his hundreds personal risk assessments saying "I might need my >>>>>>>>> gun for defense today" have all proven wrong. He's never once been >>>>>>>>> right on this!
That's a uniformly crappy track record.
We have a fire extinguisher in the shop truck and three of them in >>>>>>>> the bike shop (with 53 years of annual inspection fees I might add). >>>>>>>> I have never used one. Ever.
Think benefits vs. detriments, please.
Fire extinguishers are benign. We don't have tens of thousands of fire >>>>>>> extinguisher deaths per year. One thug beat capitol police with a fire >>>>>>> extinguisher on January 6, 2021, but that idiot was an extreme
outlier, whom Trump tried to turn into a hero.
(So much for complaints about criminals going free, eh?)
Difficult mix of cases but they all did time, and hard time at that. >>>>>
Weren't you the guy that was quoting percentages just a bit ago?
"About 69% of parolees in a 1978 study were rearrested for a serious
crime within six years of their release. Recidivism rates vary
depending on the type of crime, demographics, and length of time since >>>> release.
Recidivism rates by crime type
Property crimes: Have the highest recidivism rates, with estimates >>>> of 78.3% of people convicted of property crimes being rearrested over
five years
Drug offenses: Over 80% of convicted drug offenders are arrested
again within nine years
Recidivism rates by demographics
First arrested before age 18: Have the highest recidivism rates
First arrested at age 40 or older: Have the lowest recidivism
rates, below 30%
Recidivism rates by time since release
Recidivism rates are highest in the first two years after release >>>> In a 2021 study, 66% of people released from prison in 24
different states in 2008 were re-arrested within three years
Other parole and probation statistics
45% of state prison admissions are the result of violations of
probation or parole
The severity of the original conviction offense is not the only
factor that predicts recidivism risk
How common is it for released prisoners to re-offend?
May 14, 2566 BE
USAFacts
Recidivism of Young Parolees - Bureau of Justice Statistics
Approximately 69% of a group of young parolees were rearrested for >>>> a serious crime within 6 years of their release from prison, 53...
Bureau of Justice Statistics
New National Recidivism Report - Council on Criminal Justice"
You seem to be saying criminals should remain in prison, because those >>>released will likely re-offend.
So will you complain about Trump releasing those who were convicted of >>>attacking police officers at the capitol, after being caught doing so on >>>video?
Protestors and rioters have been attacking police all over the country
for years and very few of them have even got arrested.
Years ago in the little New England town I grew up in a bloke
"attached" a Cop with a "hoe" - similar to >https://www.amazon.com/Japanese-Without-Welding-Digging-Planting/dp/B0CYQ1N24K >and the Cop shot him. It was held over for the Grand Jury that ruled
it a justifiable homicide.
Since then no known attacks on Cops (:-)
On Thu, 13 Mar 2025 12:52:26 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/12/2025 11:24 PM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 08:20:42 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/12/2025 5:32 AM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 04:19:11 -0400, zen cycle
<funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com> >>>>>>> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish for firearms, and
the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for paranoia so >>>>>>>>>> severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to do ordinary >>>>>>>>>> things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill a gas tank, etc.
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias. Not this one. >>>>>>>>>>
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist. One classmate of >>>>>>>>>> mine in an adult education class brought his handgun to a class picnic
in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy paranoia. Another guy, >>>>>>>>>> less admirable in general, bragged to me about carrying his handgun >>>>>>>>>> into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute stupidity, and crazy >>>>>>>>>> paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that he used a special
stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly. Maybe his physical >>>>>>>>>> shortcomings triggered feelings of great vulnerability, as with Mr. >>>>>>>>>> Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off the charts crazy -
as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain that this >>>>>>>>> shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced a deranged madman
shooting into a crown before, and most probably never will again. >>>>>>>>>
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-citizen-landed-8- >>>>>>>>> of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15-seconds/ >>>>>>>>>
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying only days after the
Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without preparation is >>>>>>>>> excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some diligence and range
time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for personal protection and
never take the time and diligence. If there was a law requiring range >>>>>>>> time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more confident in the >>>>>>>> general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like this are far more >>>>>>>> prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-and-kills-mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend committed an illegal >>>>>>> act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about a legal act. >>>>>>>
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
not much. The gun fetishists (lobby) thinks any restrictions on gun >>>>>> ownership are unconstitutional. In their (small) minds, the boyfriend >>>>>> did nothing wrong.
Re restrictions on gun ownership???
The first piece of national gun control legislation was passed on June >>>>> 26, 1934. The National Firearms Act (NFA)
Which is not germane to the point that the gun fetishists (lobby) think >>>> any restrictions on gun ownership are unconstitutional.
Really? Is the NRA advocating fully automatic weapons, extremely
short barrel rifles, etc., that the NFA bans?
1) fully auto weapons are legal but with restrictions.
Not officially, but there are those who do agree with unlimited
ownership, especially automatic weapons.
https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/comments/4b18us/cmv_we_should_legalize_fully_automatic_weapons/?rdt=40807
Yup... one in the discussion group...
rather like Frank and his
coward.
On 3/12/2025 7:20 AM, Zen Cycle wrote:
On 3/12/2025 5:32 AM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 04:19:11 -0400, zen cycle
<funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle
<funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish
for firearms, and
the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for
paranoia so
severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to
do ordinary
things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill
a gas tank, etc.
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias.
Not this one.
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist.
One classmate of
mine in an adult education class brought his handgun
to a class picnic
in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy
paranoia. Another guy,
less admirable in general, bragged to me about
carrying his handgun
into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute
stupidity, and crazy
paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that
he used a special
stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly.
Maybe his physical
shortcomings triggered feelings of great
vulnerability, as with Mr.
Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off
the charts crazy -
as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain
that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced
a deranged madman
shooting into a crown before, and most probably never
will again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-
citizen-landed-8-
of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15-
seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying
only days after the
Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without
preparation is
excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some
diligence and range
time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for
personal protection and
never take the time and diligence. If there was a law
requiring range
time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more
confident in the
general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like this
are far more
prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-
and-kills-mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend committed
an illegal
act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about a
legal act.
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
not much. The gun fetishists (lobby) thinks any
restrictions on gun
ownership are unconstitutional. In their (small) minds,
the boyfriend
did nothing wrong.
Re restrictions on gun ownership???
The first piece of national gun control legislation was
passed on June
26, 1934. The National Firearms Act (NFA)
Which is not germane to the point that the gun fetishists
(lobby) think any restrictions on gun ownership are
unconstitutional.
With good reason.
Because the actual written text doesn't comport with the
many and various National Firearms Acts.
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 08:30:31 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/12/2025 7:20 AM, Zen Cycle wrote:
On 3/12/2025 5:32 AM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 04:19:11 -0400, zen cycle
<funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle
<funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish
for firearms, and
the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for
paranoia so
severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to
do ordinary
things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill
a gas tank, etc.
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias.
Not this one.
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist.
One classmate of
mine in an adult education class brought his handgun
to a class picnic
in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy
paranoia. Another guy,
less admirable in general, bragged to me about
carrying his handgun
into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute
stupidity, and crazy
paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that
he used a special
stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly.
Maybe his physical
shortcomings triggered feelings of great
vulnerability, as with Mr.
Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off
the charts crazy -
as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain
that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced
a deranged madman
shooting into a crown before, and most probably never
will again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-
citizen-landed-8-
of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15-
seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying
only days after the
Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without
preparation is
excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some
diligence and range
time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for
personal protection and
never take the time and diligence. If there was a law
requiring range
time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more
confident in the
general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like this
are far more
prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-
and-kills-mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend committed
an illegal
act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about a
legal act.
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
not much. The gun fetishists (lobby) thinks any
restrictions on gun
ownership are unconstitutional. In their (small) minds,
the boyfriend
did nothing wrong.
Re restrictions on gun ownership???
The first piece of national gun control legislation was
passed on June
26, 1934. The National Firearms Act (NFA)
Which is not germane to the point that the gun fetishists
(lobby) think any restrictions on gun ownership are
unconstitutional.
With good reason.
Because the actual written text doesn't comport with the
many and various National Firearms Acts.
In my opinion, full automatic weapons should be illegal or heavily
controlled as they currently are, but the problem is that US
Constitution says otherwise. There's also a problem with trying to
modify the 2nd Amendment in that there's never going to be an
agreement on how to modify it.
I guess we'll just have to live with unconstitutional laws.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
On 12 Mar 2025 17:00:23 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 12 Mar 2025 06:31:29 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 15:46:28 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>
cyclintom <cyclintom@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Tue Mar 11 10:58:45 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own >>>>>>>>>>>>> behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are >>>>>>>>>>>> horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees,
graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying >>>>>>>>>>>> lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in >>>>>>>>>>>>> inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet >>>>>>>>>>>> found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in
suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path. >>>>>>>>>>>
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going >>>>>>>>>> out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe
with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the >>>>>>>>>> gun on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion, >>>>>>>>> shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a >>>>>>>>> certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
I?m assuming this was the Vietnam war or similar which is a
kinda difficult
risk case to put it mildly!
And yes there are places where having a gun on you seems a
wise decision,
riding your bike even in America doesn?t seems likely hence
the absence of
bike specific kit to do so.
Do you suppose that Vietnam or Laos is safe today?
I?d assume so yes, I?d confidently predict it has lower violent crime rate
than US, certainly folks who have gone there or lived there
haven?t claimed
they needed a gun or someone with gun for protection!
Roger Merriman
I can't speak for Vietnam or Laos, which are both Communist, but in >>>>> Thailand, my nephew - manages a family business in the village -
estimates that every business will have at least one gun (legal or
not) on the premises and all gold shops, for sure, will have one at
the sales counter, and they will shoot.
That is moving goal posts, ie folks are using guns as deterrent against >>>> robbery at high value stores.
And yes guns can be a deterrent, here as the armed police are so lethal, >>>> and using a gun will make you a target both literally and for
investigation, so only very dumb folks use guns as the risks are so high, >>>> and tend to pay the price for doing so.
That?s rather different to having a gun, for bike ride or popping to the >>>> shops and so on.
Roger Merriman
The Europeans, especially the Brits, are much more willing to let
their government run their lives for them than we USAians. The attempt
here to move us in that direction that was soundly rejected in the
last election.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
Guns as protection or other weapons where used particularly in the era of >>the highwaymen but was more seen as tool than a culture, ie when the risk >>diminished then it fell out of use and over time became regulated.
Roger Merriman
From what I understand, in the UK, guns were regulated out of
existance by the government.
On 3/14/2025 9:33 AM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 08:30:31 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/12/2025 7:20 AM, Zen Cycle wrote:
On 3/12/2025 5:32 AM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 04:19:11 -0400, zen cycle
<funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle
<funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish
for firearms, and
the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for
paranoia so
severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to
do ordinary
things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill
a gas tank, etc.
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias.
Not this one.
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist.
One classmate of
mine in an adult education class brought his handgun
to a class picnic
in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy
paranoia. Another guy,
less admirable in general, bragged to me about
carrying his handgun
into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute
stupidity, and crazy
paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that
he used a special
stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly.
Maybe his physical
shortcomings triggered feelings of great
vulnerability, as with Mr.
Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off
the charts crazy -
as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain
that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced
a deranged madman
shooting into a crown before, and most probably never
will again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-
citizen-landed-8-
of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15-
seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying
only days after the
Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without
preparation is
excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some
diligence and range
time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for
personal protection and
never take the time and diligence. If there was a law
requiring range
time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more
confident in the
general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like this
are far more
prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-
and-kills-mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend committed
an illegal
act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about a
legal act.
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
not much. The gun fetishists (lobby) thinks any
restrictions on gun
ownership are unconstitutional. In their (small) minds,
the boyfriend
did nothing wrong.
Re restrictions on gun ownership???
The first piece of national gun control legislation was
passed on June
26, 1934. The National Firearms Act (NFA)
Which is not germane to the point that the gun fetishists
(lobby) think any restrictions on gun ownership are
unconstitutional.
With good reason.
Because the actual written text doesn't comport with the
many and various National Firearms Acts.
In my opinion, full automatic weapons should be illegal or heavily
controlled as they currently are, but the problem is that US
Constitution says otherwise. There's also a problem with trying to
modify the 2nd Amendment in that there's never going to be an
agreement on how to modify it.
I guess we'll just have to live with unconstitutional laws.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
Yes, the inherent conflict is and will remain unresolved. As
in so many Constitutional questions (I'm thinking of the
utter abuse of the Commerce Clause after FDR).
Meanwhile, theory and actual enforcement do vary:
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/man-on-pretrial-release-for-machine-gun-case-shot-his-girlfriend-during-an-argument-over-weed-prosecutors.html
On Fri, 14 Mar 2025 12:00:03 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/14/2025 9:33 AM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 08:30:31 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/12/2025 7:20 AM, Zen Cycle wrote:
On 3/12/2025 5:32 AM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 04:19:11 -0400, zen cycle
<funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle
<funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish
for firearms, and
the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for
paranoia so
severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to
do ordinary
things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill
a gas tank, etc.
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias.
Not this one.
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist.
One classmate of
mine in an adult education class brought his handgun
to a class picnic
in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy
paranoia. Another guy,
less admirable in general, bragged to me about
carrying his handgun
into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute
stupidity, and crazy
paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that
he used a special
stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly.
Maybe his physical
shortcomings triggered feelings of great
vulnerability, as with Mr.
Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off
the charts crazy -
as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain
that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced
a deranged madman
shooting into a crown before, and most probably never
will again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-
citizen-landed-8-
of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15-
seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying
only days after the
Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without
preparation is
excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some
diligence and range
time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for
personal protection and
never take the time and diligence. If there was a law
requiring range
time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more
confident in the
general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like this
are far more
prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-
and-kills-mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend committed
an illegal
act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about a
legal act.
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
not much. The gun fetishists (lobby) thinks any
restrictions on gun
ownership are unconstitutional. In their (small) minds,
the boyfriend
did nothing wrong.
Re restrictions on gun ownership???
The first piece of national gun control legislation was
passed on June
26, 1934. The National Firearms Act (NFA)
Which is not germane to the point that the gun fetishists
(lobby) think any restrictions on gun ownership are
unconstitutional.
With good reason.
Because the actual written text doesn't comport with the
many and various National Firearms Acts.
In my opinion, full automatic weapons should be illegal or heavily
controlled as they currently are, but the problem is that US
Constitution says otherwise. There's also a problem with trying to
modify the 2nd Amendment in that there's never going to be an
agreement on how to modify it.
I guess we'll just have to live with unconstitutional laws.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
Yes, the inherent conflict is and will remain unresolved. As
in so many Constitutional questions (I'm thinking of the
utter abuse of the Commerce Clause after FDR).
Meanwhile, theory and actual enforcement do vary:
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/man-on-pretrial-release-for-machine-gun-case-shot-his-girlfriend-during-an-argument-over-weed-prosecutors.html
+1
Reality runs up your spine
andthe peices finally fit
- Sir Elton
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> writes:
On 12 Mar 2025 17:00:23 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 12 Mar 2025 06:31:29 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 15:46:28 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>>
cyclintom <cyclintom@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Tue Mar 11 10:58:45 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own >>>>>>>>>>>>>> behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are >>>>>>>>>>>>> horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees, >>>>>>>>>>>>> graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying >>>>>>>>>>>>> lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in >>>>>>>>>>>>>> inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet >>>>>>>>>>>>> found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in >>>>>>>>>>>>> suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider.
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path. >>>>>>>>>>>>
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going >>>>>>>>>>> out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe >>>>>>>>>>> with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the >>>>>>>>>>> gun on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion, >>>>>>>>>> shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a >>>>>>>>>> certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
I?m assuming this was the Vietnam war or similar which is a
kinda difficult
risk case to put it mildly!
And yes there are places where having a gun on you seems a
wise decision,
riding your bike even in America doesn?t seems likely hence
the absence of
bike specific kit to do so.
Do you suppose that Vietnam or Laos is safe today?
I?d assume so yes, I?d confidently predict it has lower violent crime rate
than US, certainly folks who have gone there or lived there
haven?t claimed
they needed a gun or someone with gun for protection!
Roger Merriman
I can't speak for Vietnam or Laos, which are both Communist, but in >>>>>> Thailand, my nephew - manages a family business in the village -
estimates that every business will have at least one gun (legal or >>>>>> not) on the premises and all gold shops, for sure, will have one at >>>>>> the sales counter, and they will shoot.
That is moving goal posts, ie folks are using guns as deterrent against >>>>> robbery at high value stores.
And yes guns can be a deterrent, here as the armed police are so lethal, >>>>> and using a gun will make you a target both literally and for
investigation, so only very dumb folks use guns as the risks are so high, >>>>> and tend to pay the price for doing so.
That?s rather different to having a gun, for bike ride or popping to the >>>>> shops and so on.
Roger Merriman
The Europeans, especially the Brits, are much more willing to let
their government run their lives for them than we USAians. The attempt >>>> here to move us in that direction that was soundly rejected in the
last election.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
Guns as protection or other weapons where used particularly in the era of >>> the highwaymen but was more seen as tool than a culture, ie when the risk >>> diminished then it fell out of use and over time became regulated.
Roger Merriman
From what I understand, in the UK, guns were regulated out of
existance by the government.
According to George Orwell, if I recall correctly, and can't be arsed to
try to look it up, firearms in the UK went from easily available to
tightly regulated about the time that the upper classes began to fear a homegrown Bolshevik revolution.
On 3/14/2025 4:36 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Fri, 14 Mar 2025 16:33:22 -0400, Catrike Ryder
<Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On Fri, 14 Mar 2025 12:00:03 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/14/2025 9:33 AM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 08:30:31 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>>
On 3/12/2025 7:20 AM, Zen Cycle wrote:
On 3/12/2025 5:32 AM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 04:19:11 -0400, zen cycle
<funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle
<funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish >>>>>>>>>>>>> for firearms, and
the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for >>>>>>>>>>>>> paranoia so
severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to >>>>>>>>>>>>> do ordinary
things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill >>>>>>>>>>>>> a gas tank, etc.
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias. >>>>>>>>>>>>> Not this one.
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist.
One classmate of
mine in an adult education class brought his handgun >>>>>>>>>>>>> to a class picnic
in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy
paranoia. Another guy,
less admirable in general, bragged to me about
carrying his handgun
into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute
stupidity, and crazy
paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that >>>>>>>>>>>>> he used a special
stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly.
Maybe his physical
shortcomings triggered feelings of great
vulnerability, as with Mr.
Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off
the charts crazy -
as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain
that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced
a deranged madman
shooting into a crown before, and most probably never
will again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-
citizen-landed-8-
of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15-
seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying
only days after the
Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without
preparation is
excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some
diligence and range
time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for
personal protection and
never take the time and diligence. If there was a law
requiring range
time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more
confident in the
general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like this
are far more
prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-
and-kills-mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend committed
an illegal
act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about a
legal act.
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
not much. The gun fetishists (lobby) thinks any
restrictions on gun
ownership are unconstitutional. In their (small) minds,
the boyfriend
did nothing wrong.
Re restrictions on gun ownership???
The first piece of national gun control legislation was
passed on June
26, 1934. The National Firearms Act (NFA)
Which is not germane to the point that the gun fetishists
(lobby) think any restrictions on gun ownership are
unconstitutional.
With good reason.
Because the actual written text doesn't comport with the
many and various National Firearms Acts.
In my opinion, full automatic weapons should be illegal or heavily
controlled as they currently are, but the problem is that US
Constitution says otherwise. There's also a problem with trying to
modify the 2nd Amendment in that there's never going to be an
agreement on how to modify it.
I guess we'll just have to live with unconstitutional laws.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
Yes, the inherent conflict is and will remain unresolved. As
in so many Constitutional questions (I'm thinking of the
utter abuse of the Commerce Clause after FDR).
Meanwhile, theory and actual enforcement do vary:
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/man-on-pretrial-release-for-machine-gun-case-shot-his-girlfriend-during-an-argument-over-weed-prosecutors.html
+1
Reality runs up your spine
andthe peices finally fit
- Sir Elton
Good grief... spell check much?
Reality runs up your spine
andthe peices finally fit
- Sir Elton
That's funny! Try again.
On 3/14/2025 4:36 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Fri, 14 Mar 2025 16:33:22 -0400, Catrike Ryder
<Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On Fri, 14 Mar 2025 12:00:03 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/14/2025 9:33 AM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 08:30:31 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>>
On 3/12/2025 7:20 AM, Zen Cycle wrote:
On 3/12/2025 5:32 AM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 04:19:11 -0400, zen cycle
<funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle
<funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish >>>>>>>>>>>>> for firearms, and
the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for >>>>>>>>>>>>> paranoia so
severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to >>>>>>>>>>>>> do ordinary
things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill >>>>>>>>>>>>> a gas tank, etc.
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias. >>>>>>>>>>>>> Not this one.
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist.
One classmate of
mine in an adult education class brought his handgun >>>>>>>>>>>>> to a class picnic
in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy
paranoia. Another guy,
less admirable in general, bragged to me about
carrying his handgun
into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute
stupidity, and crazy
paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that >>>>>>>>>>>>> he used a special
stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly.
Maybe his physical
shortcomings triggered feelings of great
vulnerability, as with Mr.
Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off
the charts crazy -
as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain
that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced >>>>>>>>>>>> a deranged madman
shooting into a crown before, and most probably never
will again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-
citizen-landed-8-
of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15-
seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying
only days after the
Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without
preparation is
excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some
diligence and range
time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for
personal protection and
never take the time and diligence. If there was a law
requiring range
time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more
confident in the
general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like this
are far more
prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-
and-kills-mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend committed
an illegal
act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about a
legal act.
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
not much. The gun fetishists (lobby) thinks any
restrictions on gun
ownership are unconstitutional. In their (small) minds,
the boyfriend
did nothing wrong.
Re restrictions on gun ownership???
The first piece of national gun control legislation was
passed on June
26, 1934. The National Firearms Act (NFA)
Which is not germane to the point that the gun fetishists
(lobby) think any restrictions on gun ownership are
unconstitutional.
With good reason.
Because the actual written text doesn't comport with the
many and various National Firearms Acts.
In my opinion, full automatic weapons should be illegal or heavily
controlled as they currently are, but the problem is that US
Constitution says otherwise. There's also a problem with trying to >>>>> modify the 2nd Amendment in that there's never going to be an
agreement on how to modify it.
I guess we'll just have to live with unconstitutional laws.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
Yes, the inherent conflict is and will remain unresolved. As
in so many Constitutional questions (I'm thinking of the
utter abuse of the Commerce Clause after FDR).
Meanwhile, theory and actual enforcement do vary:
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/man-on-pretrial-release-for-machine-
gun-case-shot-his-girlfriend-during-an-argument-over-weed-
prosecutors.html
+1
Reality runs up your spine
andthe peices finally fit
- Sir Elton
Good grief... spell check much?
Reality runs up your spine
andthe peices finally fit
- Sir Elton
That's funny! Try again.
On Fri, 14 Mar 2025 09:29:43 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/13/2025 8:23 PM, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 13 Mar 2025 12:52:26 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/12/2025 11:24 PM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 08:20:42 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com> >>>>> wrote:
On 3/12/2025 5:32 AM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 04:19:11 -0400, zen cycle
<funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish for firearms, and
the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for paranoia so >>>>>>>>>>>> severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to do ordinary >>>>>>>>>>>> things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill a gas tank, etc.
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias. Not this one. >>>>>>>>>>>>
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist. One classmate of
mine in an adult education class brought his handgun to a class picnic
in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy paranoia. Another guy,
less admirable in general, bragged to me about carrying his handgun
into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute stupidity, and crazy
paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that he used a special
stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly. Maybe his physical
shortcomings triggered feelings of great vulnerability, as with Mr.
Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off the charts crazy -
as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'.
Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain that this >>>>>>>>>>> shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced a deranged madman
shooting into a crown before, and most probably never will again. >>>>>>>>>>>
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed-citizen-landed-8-
of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15-seconds/ >>>>>>>>>>>
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying only days after the
Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without preparation is >>>>>>>>>>> excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some diligence and range
time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for personal protection and
never take the time and diligence. If there was a law requiring range
time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more confident in the >>>>>>>>>> general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like this are far more >>>>>>>>>> prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-and-kills-mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend committed an illegal >>>>>>>>> act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about a legal act. >>>>>>>>>
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
not much. The gun fetishists (lobby) thinks any restrictions on gun >>>>>>>> ownership are unconstitutional. In their (small) minds, the boyfriend >>>>>>>> did nothing wrong.
Re restrictions on gun ownership???
The first piece of national gun control legislation was passed on June >>>>>>> 26, 1934. The National Firearms Act (NFA)
Which is not germane to the point that the gun fetishists (lobby) think >>>>>> any restrictions on gun ownership are unconstitutional.
Really? Is the NRA advocating fully automatic weapons, extremely
short barrel rifles, etc., that the NFA bans?
1) fully auto weapons are legal but with restrictions.
Not officially, but there are those who do agree with unlimited
ownership, especially automatic weapons.
https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/comments/4b18us/cmv_we_should_legalize_fully_automatic_weapons/?rdt=40807
Yup... one in the discussion group...
Did you bother to read the discussion? It's more than one, and as
someone who lives in the US and is exposed to the gun fetishists
YUp. I did read it and just reread it . There was no one arguing for unrestricted ownership of a full auto, i.e. machine gun. except the
first reference and his was a sort of question " hope this hasn't been
posted too many times, I'm new here :)"
And please no carefully cut and trimming posts to prove "your"
argument (:-)
rather like Frank and his
coward.
Who is"Frank's Coward"? The floriduh dumbass who's afraid to leave his
house without his gun? Sure, I'll buy that.
On 14 Mar 2025 21:41:14 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Radey Shouman <shouman@comcast.net> wrote:https://www.jstor.org/stable/j.ctt1btc60t
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> writes:
On 12 Mar 2025 17:00:23 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On 12 Mar 2025 06:31:29 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>>
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 15:46:28 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>
cyclintom <cyclintom@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Tue Mar 11 10:58:45 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11 Mar 2025 10:23:20 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 3/10/2025 6:21 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 2:38 PM, AMuzi wrote:
People form their own opinions and arrange their own >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> behavior based on their own situation.
Yes - or based on their own phobias. I know people who are >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> horribly afraid of spiders, garter snakes, honeybees, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> graveyards and more.
Smart? No. Logical? No. But at least they're not carrying >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> lethal weaponry.
My daughter for example used to take the train to work in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> inclement or bitter cold Chicago winters.
No longer. ...
You're the anecdote master, Andrew. But IIRC you've not yet >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> found a horrifying anecdote about quiet bike paths in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> suburban Florida, near our timid tricycle rider. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
The murder of this thread was of an unarmed man on a bike path. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Just because it can happen doesnt mean it will happen, going >>>>>>>>>>>>> out on limb
but I suspect that CatTrike Ryder will be perfectly safe >>>>>>>>>>>>> with or without
carrying any guns on his rides.
I suspect he knows this as well, but simply likes having the >>>>>>>>>>>>> gun on him?
Roger Merriman
I spent more then a year in Vietnam where people did, on occasion, >>>>>>>>>>>> shoot at you and I can assure you that a firearm did give you a >>>>>>>>>>>> certain sense of security :-)
Even when they weren't shooting :-)
I?m assuming this was the Vietnam war or similar which is a >>>>>>>>>>> kinda difficult
risk case to put it mildly!
And yes there are places where having a gun on you seems a >>>>>>>>>>> wise decision,
riding your bike even in America doesn?t seems likely hence >>>>>>>>>>> the absence of
bike specific kit to do so.
Do you suppose that Vietnam or Laos is safe today?
I?d assume so yes, I?d confidently predict it has lower violent crime rate
than US, certainly folks who have gone there or lived there
haven?t claimed
they needed a gun or someone with gun for protection!
Roger Merriman
I can't speak for Vietnam or Laos, which are both Communist, but in >>>>>>>> Thailand, my nephew - manages a family business in the village - >>>>>>>> estimates that every business will have at least one gun (legal or >>>>>>>> not) on the premises and all gold shops, for sure, will have one at >>>>>>>> the sales counter, and they will shoot.
That is moving goal posts, ie folks are using guns as deterrent against >>>>>>> robbery at high value stores.
And yes guns can be a deterrent, here as the armed police are so lethal,
and using a gun will make you a target both literally and for
investigation, so only very dumb folks use guns as the risks are so high,
and tend to pay the price for doing so.
That?s rather different to having a gun, for bike ride or popping to the
shops and so on.
Roger Merriman
The Europeans, especially the Brits, are much more willing to let
their government run their lives for them than we USAians. The attempt >>>>>> here to move us in that direction that was soundly rejected in the >>>>>> last election.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
Guns as protection or other weapons where used particularly in the era of >>>>> the highwaymen but was more seen as tool than a culture, ie when the risk >>>>> diminished then it fell out of use and over time became regulated.
Roger Merriman
From what I understand, in the UK, guns were regulated out of
existance by the government.
According to George Orwell, if I recall correctly, and can't be arsed to >>> try to look it up, firearms in the UK went from easily available to
tightly regulated about the time that the upper classes began to fear a
homegrown Bolshevik revolution.
Ish, was number of factors in 1920 being yes fears of working class
revolution, to the supply of weapons from the Great war, to the conflict
with Ireland.
Wasnt terribly regulated even then, and weapons have been legislated in uk >> for getting on for 1000 years now, even firearms or at least pistols
regulations seem to predate American as colonies let alone a country.
Hence its become more regulated over time, most of early 20th century
laws, where not much of hindrance to access or ownership really.
Roger Merriman
"Gun Culture in Early Modern England"
Almost as soon as guns became available in the early sixteenth
century, the English government imposed on its subjects whose income
was beneath a prescribed level an array of regulations that limited
their possession and use of firearms.¹ Using statutes and
proclamations, the authorities amplified the effort begun in the
Middle Ages to prevent persons at the lower rungs of society from
having access to weapons.
On Fri, 14 Mar 2025 23:03:45 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/14/2025 4:36 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Fri, 14 Mar 2025 16:33:22 -0400, Catrike Ryder
<Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On Fri, 14 Mar 2025 12:00:03 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>
On 3/14/2025 9:33 AM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 08:30:31 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>>>
On 3/12/2025 7:20 AM, Zen Cycle wrote:
On 3/12/2025 5:32 AM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 04:19:11 -0400, zen cycle
<funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle
<funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish >>>>>>>>>>>>>> for firearms, and
the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for >>>>>>>>>>>>>> paranoia so
severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to >>>>>>>>>>>>>> do ordinary
things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill >>>>>>>>>>>>>> a gas tank, etc.
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Not this one.
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> One classmate of
mine in an adult education class brought his handgun >>>>>>>>>>>>>> to a class picnic
in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy
paranoia. Another guy,
less admirable in general, bragged to me about
carrying his handgun
into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute
stupidity, and crazy
paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that >>>>>>>>>>>>>> he used a special
stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly.
Maybe his physical
shortcomings triggered feelings of great
vulnerability, as with Mr.
Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the charts crazy -
as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'. >>>>>>>>>>>>> Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain >>>>>>>>>>>>> that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced >>>>>>>>>>>>> a deranged madman
shooting into a crown before, and most probably never >>>>>>>>>>>>> will again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed- >>>>>>>>>>>>> citizen-landed-8-
of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15- >>>>>>>>>>>>> seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying
only days after the
Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without
preparation is
excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some
diligence and range
time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for
personal protection and
never take the time and diligence. If there was a law
requiring range
time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more
confident in the
general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like this >>>>>>>>>>>> are far more
prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots-
and-kills-mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend committed >>>>>>>>>>> an illegal
act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about a >>>>>>>>>>> legal act.
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
not much. The gun fetishists (lobby) thinks any
restrictions on gun
ownership are unconstitutional. In their (small) minds,
the boyfriend
did nothing wrong.
Re restrictions on gun ownership???
The first piece of national gun control legislation was
passed on June
26, 1934. The National Firearms Act (NFA)
Which is not germane to the point that the gun fetishists
(lobby) think any restrictions on gun ownership are
unconstitutional.
With good reason.
Because the actual written text doesn't comport with the
many and various National Firearms Acts.
In my opinion, full automatic weapons should be illegal or heavily >>>>>> controlled as they currently are, but the problem is that US
Constitution says otherwise. There's also a problem with trying to >>>>>> modify the 2nd Amendment in that there's never going to be an
agreement on how to modify it.
I guess we'll just have to live with unconstitutional laws.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
Yes, the inherent conflict is and will remain unresolved. As
in so many Constitutional questions (I'm thinking of the
utter abuse of the Commerce Clause after FDR).
Meanwhile, theory and actual enforcement do vary:
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/man-on-pretrial-release-for-machine-gun-case-shot-his-girlfriend-during-an-argument-over-weed-prosecutors.html
+1
Reality runs up your spine
andthe peices finally fit
- Sir Elton
Good grief... spell check much?
Reality runs up your spine
andthe peices finally fit
- Sir Elton
That's funny! Try again.
Yeah, proofreading is a terrible chore for speedreaders. I read it to
say exactly what I meant it to say when I speedwrote it. My wife is
the proofreader for my books. She spots errors in books written by
famous successful writers that I won't see unless she point them out.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On Fri, 14 Mar 2025 23:03:45 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 3/14/2025 4:36 PM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Fri, 14 Mar 2025 16:33:22 -0400, Catrike Ryder
<Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
On Fri, 14 Mar 2025 12:00:03 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>>
On 3/14/2025 9:33 AM, Catrike Ryder wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 08:30:31 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote: >>>>>>>
On 3/12/2025 7:20 AM, Zen Cycle wrote:
On 3/12/2025 5:32 AM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2025 04:19:11 -0400, zen cycle
<funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2025 10:20:18 -0400, Zen Cycle
<funkmaster@hotmail.com>
wrote:
On 3/11/2025 8:57 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2025 10:09 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/10/2025 9:37 PM, John B. wrote:
Well... you exhibit a fear of firearms ...
Bullshit. I exhibit distaste for the American fetish >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for firearms, and
the effect it has on society. And I exhibit scorn for >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> paranoia so
severe as to cause a person to _require_ a firearm to >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> do ordinary
things like ride a quiet bike path, drive a car, fill >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a gas tank, etc.
I'm sympathetic to those controlled by some phobias. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Not this one.
And BTW, it's not just our super-timid tricyclist. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> One classmate of
mine in an adult education class brought his handgun >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to a class picnic
in the country. Nice guy, but that was crazy
paranoia. Another guy,
less admirable in general, bragged to me about
carrying his handgun
into a folk music concert we attended. Absolute
stupidity, and crazy
paranoia.
That latter guy played guitar, but was so obese that >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> he used a special
stand to hold his guitar out away from his belly. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Maybe his physical
shortcomings triggered feelings of great
vulnerability, as with Mr.
Tricycle? Nonetheless, his risk assessment was off >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the charts crazy -
as is Mr. Tricycle's.
Replace 'firearm' in the above with 'bicycle helmet'. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Same argument.
And regarding risk assessment, I'm reasonable certain >>>>>>>>>>>>>> that this
shopping mall in Greenwood Indiana never experienced >>>>>>>>>>>>>> a deranged madman
shooting into a crown before, and most probably never >>>>>>>>>>>>>> will again.
However, on one fine July day, it happened.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/07/hero-armed- >>>>>>>>>>>>>> citizen-landed-8-
of-10-shots-at-40-yards-to-stop-mass-shooting-in-15- >>>>>>>>>>>>>> seconds/
Not especially that Mr Dicken was lawfully carrying >>>>>>>>>>>>>> only days after the
Indiana statute had changed to allow carry.
p.s. 8 of ten at 40 feet instantaneously without
preparation is
excellent marksmanship. Not achievable without some >>>>>>>>>>>>>> diligence and range
time.
Which doesn't bode well for people who carry for
personal protection and
never take the time and diligence. If there was a law >>>>>>>>>>>>> requiring range
time and accuracy to carry a gun, I'd be a lot more
confident in the
general public carrying guns. Instead, cases like this >>>>>>>>>>>>> are far more
prevalent:
https://people.com/calif-toddler-accidentally-shoots- >>>>>>>>>>>>> and-kills-mother-with-unsecured-gun-police-8759431
Ah But, as your reference states the boyfriend committed >>>>>>>>>>>> an illegal
act, and was charged, The Florida guy is talking about a >>>>>>>>>>>> legal act.
A bit of a difference, wouldn't one think?
not much. The gun fetishists (lobby) thinks any
restrictions on gun
ownership are unconstitutional. In their (small) minds,
the boyfriend
did nothing wrong.
Re restrictions on gun ownership???
The first piece of national gun control legislation was
passed on June
26, 1934. The National Firearms Act (NFA)
Which is not germane to the point that the gun fetishists
(lobby) think any restrictions on gun ownership are
unconstitutional.
With good reason.
Because the actual written text doesn't comport with the
many and various National Firearms Acts.
In my opinion, full automatic weapons should be illegal or heavily >>>>>>> controlled as they currently are, but the problem is that US
Constitution says otherwise. There's also a problem with trying to >>>>>>> modify the 2nd Amendment in that there's never going to be an
agreement on how to modify it.
I guess we'll just have to live with unconstitutional laws.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
Yes, the inherent conflict is and will remain unresolved. As
in so many Constitutional questions (I'm thinking of the
utter abuse of the Commerce Clause after FDR).
Meanwhile, theory and actual enforcement do vary:
https://cwbchicago.com/2025/03/man-on-pretrial-release-for-machine-gun-case-shot-his-girlfriend-during-an-argument-over-weed-prosecutors.html
+1
Reality runs up your spine
andthe peices finally fit
- Sir Elton
Good grief... spell check much?
Reality runs up your spine
andthe peices finally fit
- Sir Elton
That's funny! Try again.
Yeah, proofreading is a terrible chore for speedreaders. I read it to
say exactly what I meant it to say when I speedwrote it. My wife is
the proofreader for my books. She spots errors in books written by
famous successful writers that I won't see unless she point them out.
--
C'est bon
Soloman
That was one of my wifes roles to proofread documents and go though legal >documents to find any errors or clauses that they needed to query!
Roger Merriman
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