Hi all
Is this a UK only thing?
Had a moment where I thought "This is a crock of ...." and left
questioning whether ever worth coming back to welding work.
This is a general situation - don't construe one Company
There's "health and safety officers" and "project managers" but no
quality control. They cruise up to NDT/NDE towards the end of the
project / build with no quality control then get upset and do
managerial things when those final inspections are declared not
meeting specification.
Like - to a technical mind - in what way does that make sense?
Techniques used for welding are never critically evaluated -
qualitatively and quantitatively - to prove whether or not a welding
solution provides the range of requirements needed (forget "Weld
Procedure Qualification Records" and "Welding Procedure
Specifications" - they are a side-show of no direct relevance to
production welding).
Always centred on the mystique of "learning the magic weave" (sic.)
I worked hard for many years learning techniques and delivering welds
- but came to this moment of - what is there here as I arrive which it
worth the striving I put in?!
Anyone else met this?
Is a UK thing with our "post-industrial" "service economy" "managerial excellence" way?
The search for "objective verifiable criteria" has lead to a "tick-box culture" with all sense departed long ago?
On 4/26/2022 12:28 AM, Richard Smith wrote:
Hi all
... ...
culture" with all sense departed long ago?
I'm just going to say there is always more to the story. The thing is
people generally gravitate to the easiest answer.
Tell a kid who got in trouble for fighting in school that its not ok
to fight unless you have no choice they will ALWAYS say they had no
choice. That's the easiest answer.
In my business people tell me they want a custom mold made, but then
they have no idea what they want or they just want to knockoff
somebody else. That's the easiest answer.
The other day I had a guy contact me who was all over the place with
what he wanted. After going back and forth for a while I asked him,
"Do you want me to just guess, design something up from scratch, let
you try it on for size, and if you don't like take another guess and
start over?"
He replied, "That would be great," instead of noticing I was dripping
with sarcasm. That was the easiest answer.
People latch onto the easiest answer.
I don't have to do it today.
Somebody else will do it.
I called in sick that day.
You expect me to think about the job for a second on my day off?
We can blame it on the welder if the weld fails.
The painter will cover it up.
Don't worry about the spec not being adequate. Just do it and we will
charge them for a change order and repairs later.
Tell the subs to "help us out" and fix it for free or we will get
other subs.
"Richard Smith" wrote in message news:lypml48frq.fsf@void.com...
Hi all
...
culture" with all sense departed long ago?
-----------------------
Complacency->Titanic->blame-shifting
You can see similar issues behind the Tay Bridge collapse. Deficient fabrication of the column castings and their bracing wasn't properly supervised or appreciated until too late. The bridge's designer had
succumbed to excessive cost-cutting pressure. The responsible foundry
foreman emigrated out of reach to Australia.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Carlisle
"Contemporary documentaries claimed Carlisle retired in anger due to
Pirrie not accepting his lifeboat recommendations, if his
recommendations were accepted the overall death toll of the Titanic’s sinking would far lower."
Well, maybe. They didn't have enough time or deck hands to launch, row
and steer all the lifeboats they did have, the last two floated off as
the ship sank. The new and unfamiliar Welin davits which could handle
extra lifeboats (if provided) may have contributed to the delay, as
there are reports the crew fumbled with them.
That's the sort of management vs engineering dynamic I look for in
accident investigations, and sometimes suffered from personally. The
RMS Titanic and the space shuttle Challenger are classic examples. The booster that failed could have been fabricated locally in one piece
but it was politically necessary to distribute the spending into every
state, so they were sectioned into smaller sizes for shipment from
Utah to Florida. Officially the riskier sectional design was chosen
because it was cheaper. However ICBMs have one-piece casings. https://apnews.com/article/5ad5770e092b2341a50831c121a2b68f
Here's a great example of arrogant incompetence: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vajont_Dam
"Throughout the summer of 1960, minor landslides and earth movements
were noticed. Instead of heeding these warning signs, the Italian
government chose to sue the handful of journalists reporting the
problems for "undermining the social order".
During WW1 Rommel's handful of troops raced down that valley on
commandeered bicycles to keep the fleeing Italians ahead of them from
having enough time to blow up a bridge. It's an incredible adventure
story.
https://www.amazon.com/Infantry-Attacks-Erwin-Rommel/dp/1853670642
He was brave enough to return after the war to take photos for the book.
"Richard Smith" wrote in message news:lypml48frq.fsf@void.com...
Hi all
...
culture" with all sense departed long ago?
-----------------------
Complacency->Titanic->blame-shifting
You can see similar issues behind the Tay Bridge collapse. Deficient fabrication of the column castings and their bracing wasn't properly supervised or appreciated until too late. The bridge's designer had
succumbed to excessive cost-cutting pressure. The responsible foundry
foreman emigrated out of reach to Australia.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Carlisle
"Contemporary documentaries claimed Carlisle retired in anger due to
Pirrie not accepting his lifeboat recommendations, if his
recommendations were accepted the overall death toll of the Titanic’s sinking would far lower."
Well, maybe. They didn't have enough time or deck hands to launch, row
and steer all the lifeboats they did have, the last two floated off as
the ship sank. The new and unfamiliar Welin davits which could handle
extra lifeboats (if provided) may have contributed to the delay, as
there are reports the crew fumbled with them.
That's the sort of management vs engineering dynamic I look for in
accident investigations, and sometimes suffered from personally. The
RMS Titanic and the space shuttle Challenger are classic examples. The booster that failed could have been fabricated locally in one piece
but it was politically necessary to distribute the spending into every
state, so they were sectioned into smaller sizes for shipment from
Utah to Florida. Officially the riskier sectional design was chosen
because it was cheaper. However ICBMs have one-piece casings. https://apnews.com/article/5ad5770e092b2341a50831c121a2b68f
Here's a great example of arrogant incompetence: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vajont_Dam
"Throughout the summer of 1960, minor landslides and earth movements
were noticed. Instead of heeding these warning signs, the Italian
government chose to sue the handful of journalists reporting the
problems for "undermining the social order".
During WW1 Rommel's handful of troops raced down that valley on
commandeered bicycles to keep the fleeing Italians ahead of them from
having enough time to blow up a bridge. It's an incredible adventure
story.
https://www.amazon.com/Infantry-Attacks-Erwin-Rommel/dp/1853670642
He was brave enough to return after the war to take photos for the book.
"Richard Smith" wrote in message news:lybkwmevdv.fsf@void.com...-------------
"Jim Wilkins" <muratlanne@gmail.com> writes:
............
Thanks cautionary point see general human failing - don't expect a
picture as clear as I seem to be seeking.
I think the pattern is that we learn from and don't repeat major
mistakes, so the remaining problems are unusual accumulations of
multiple small deficiencies that don't individually seem serious
enough to pay to correct. In your case the substantial cost of a
highly qualified, certified, in-process inspector may have been deemed unnecessary if the workers' skill is usually adequate to pass final
test.
Would you take the job of telling other welders their work wasn't good enough?
My wife was an in-process visual inspector of electronic assemblies
until she was promoted to programming and operating automated final
test equipment, and not replaced.
I was the final test tech for a batch of prototype electric vehicle
battery packs that had a higher than expected defect rate. For each
defect the engineer and I had to choose between me or the production
crew making the repair. Hopefully the production crew would learn from
and not repeat mistakes, but they were mechanical assemblers with
little knowledge of electricity and didn't understand why they were
wrong, so usually I fixed the problem, faster than explaining
everything to them and waiting for them to finish.
No one has ever bothered to inspect my work, they just assume it's
good. I'm not that confident and double-check myself. Although I've
been doing my own car and motorcycle repairs for 50 years I signed up
for night classes in tune-ups and brakes to correct any bad habits I
may have acquired.
Bob La Londe <none@none.com99> writes:
On 4/26/2022 12:28 AM, Richard Smith wrote:
Hi all
... ...
culture" with all sense departed long ago?
I'm just going to say there is always more to the story. The thing is
people generally gravitate to the easiest answer.
Tell a kid who got in trouble for fighting in school that its not ok
to fight unless you have no choice they will ALWAYS say they had no
choice. That's the easiest answer.
In my business people tell me they want a custom mold made, but then
they have no idea what they want or they just want to knockoff
somebody else. That's the easiest answer.
The other day I had a guy contact me who was all over the place with
what he wanted. After going back and forth for a while I asked him,
"Do you want me to just guess, design something up from scratch, let
you try it on for size, and if you don't like take another guess and
start over?"
He replied, "That would be great," instead of noticing I was dripping
with sarcasm. That was the easiest answer.
People latch onto the easiest answer.
I don't have to do it today.
Somebody else will do it.
I called in sick that day.
You expect me to think about the job for a second on my day off?
We can blame it on the welder if the weld fails.
The painter will cover it up.
Don't worry about the spec not being adequate. Just do it and we will
charge them for a change order and repairs later.
Tell the subs to "help us out" and fix it for free or we will get
other subs.
Thanks for cautionary note. You are saying "Don't look for a too
clear picture - we all as humans succumb to easiest in-the-moment ways
out" ?
Never-the-less - I have this perception continues:
an organisation full of "health and safety officials" (sic.), "project managers", etc., cruising up to a final acceptance (rejection)
inspection with no quality control at any stage of the project is "sub-optimal".
"Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:t4f4lg$if6$1@dont-email.me...
A real engineering team checking everything and setting real quality standards is a constant drain on company resources.
-------------------
When I was testing and repairing field-return medical equipment
Lithium batteries with internal datalogs I noticed that the attention
span for managing them the prescribed way instead of the easy way was typically about 3 months, hardly ever as long as 6. Company safety or
QC campaigns after an incident lasted a similar interval before being
quietly forgotten.
W. Edwards Deming said something which I strongly recognise
"If you concentrate on costs, your costs will tend to rise. If you concentrate on quality, your costs will tend to fall"
Starting my working career in the steel industry in Sheffield in the
early 1980's, these were the survivors of 9 in 10 in the region losing
their jobs - so those left were very wise. They knew that the
tranquility you see - being able to take tea-breaks and discuss things
at leisure - was because you kept variables under tight control. They
knew that if you do not know what's going on and lose control of
processes, it would be the equivalent of your ship crashing into an
iceberg - "things would take a bad turn" (understatement).
That's not saying that these folk did not take tough decisions. Some
of the actions and interventions to leave no easier option that to
move to new operating methods were amazing for their calculated almost brutality. eg. a furnace needed for "the established method" could be demolished over the weekend and coming back the next week there was no
choice but to make the new cheaper production route work.
Unfortunately for me, that was *not* the world I moved onwards in. I
learned and took all onboard - absorbing the wisdom - and found I was
now like some lone lunatic in the wilderness in a nation where people
are payed for doing nothing (German limosines driven by people whose "contribution to the economy" is a miniscular proportion of that
"capable" foreign mechandise they are rewarded with).
Where I get a chance to work and apply my skills, I make sure that
what ships from the loading bay gets follow-up custom.
I can see what you say - but it's a muddy confused world without
purpose, navigation, direction, goals, self-belief, etc.
You are realistically describing the reality; I'm knowing that isn't
you.
On 4/29/2022 12:03 AM, Richard Smith wrote:
W. Edwards Deming said something which I strongly recognise
"If you concentrate on costs, your costs will tend to rise. If you
concentrate on quality, your costs will tend to fall"
Starting my working career in the steel industry in Sheffield in the
early 1980's, these were the survivors of 9 in 10 in the region losing
their jobs - so those left were very wise. They knew that the
tranquility you see - being able to take tea-breaks and discuss things
at leisure - was because you kept variables under tight control. They
knew that if you do not know what's going on and lose control of
processes, it would be the equivalent of your ship crashing into an
iceberg - "things would take a bad turn" (understatement).
That's not saying that these folk did not take tough decisions. Some
of the actions and interventions to leave no easier option that to
move to new operating methods were amazing for their calculated almost
brutality. eg. a furnace needed for "the established method" could be
demolished over the weekend and coming back the next week there was no
choice but to make the new cheaper production route work.
Unfortunately for me, that was *not* the world I moved onwards in. I
learned and took all onboard - absorbing the wisdom - and found I was
now like some lone lunatic in the wilderness in a nation where people
are payed for doing nothing (German limosines driven by people whose
"contribution to the economy" is a miniscular proportion of that
"capable" foreign mechandise they are rewarded with).
Where I get a chance to work and apply my skills, I make sure that
what ships from the loading bay gets follow-up custom.
I can see what you say - but it's a muddy confused world without
purpose, navigation, direction, goals, self-belief, etc.
You are realistically describing the reality; I'm knowing that isn't
you.
I was an employer for more than a couple years. I was terrible at it.
I expected people to have some pride in workmanship and expect approval
when they truly deserved it. After struggling with this one day a
technician for another company told me I was deluded. That technicians >wanted to get paid the most amount of money possible for the least
amount of effort period. I thought he was mistaken or perhaps overly >cynical. I kept trying for many years. Still I often found myself
working late and weekends so I could finish the jobs others didn't do,
and do extra work on top so I could afford to pay them for the time they >spent not getting it done. I was making some small progress, but often
it seemed like it was one step forward and two steps back.
The year I had a bad accident on a motorcycle things changed. I was
taking phone calls, and working on my computer from a hospital bed when
I wasn't to doped up on morphine. I had a couple guys and I was trying
to keep getting things done, but it wasn't working. When they put my >morphine on manual only when I pushed the button I quit taking it
preferring to be clear headed and uncomfortable than stupid in a drug
fog. When I got out I found myself almost broke with maxed out credit
cards and customers screaming at me to get jobs done. My employees were >gone. My doctor tried to put me on an anti depressant because it was
bad, but I hated the lack of drive from the drug worse than the
constantly angry buzz arguing with the sad drone in my head.
I was in a wheel chair. I could stand with a leg brace. I had a
titanium rod and 4 titanium pins in my leg, but they couldn't rebuild my >foot. They didn't want me to walk on my foot until it healed. It was
still a maraca inside. There were still pins sticking out of my hand. I >couldn't even begin to drive my service truck. I knew I couldn't do any
real jobs, but I at least had to get service calls done. I put a
sidecar on my backup motorcycle to carry my wheel chair, and put a tool
bag in the trunk. I could drive the side hack, but I couldn't operate
the foot brake. I did service calls.
I was a bit surprised when I rolled into a sleep study lab in my wheel
chair to fix a video system, and they were still nasty with me that it
took a full day for me to get there to take care of them. They had
somebody in their office who kept unplugging a monitor and then plugging
the camera input into the loop output. I tried to show them and every
time they just got angry with me and said it was a crappy system. It
wasn't. I had the same system in other sleep study labs with no issues.
I think a technician was sleeping in the room at night instead of
watching the monitors, and they were unplugging the camera and plugging
it back in when they woke up. I was glad when they said they were going
to get somebody else.
When I rolled into the office of another customer who had been screaming
at me on the phone it brought back a small amount of belief in the human >condition for me. I had never seen a Mexican turn white before. He
probably really thought I was the average technicians and I had been
lying to him about being in the hospital to cover for not taking care of
the low battery on his alarm system. Of course his alarm panel was
above his office with ladder only access. I had to figure out how to
climb the service ladder with one functional leg, and one that wouldn't
bend. I did it, but I don't have as much upper body strength as I
thought I did. At least not configured the right way for that job.
I was nearly broke and didn't know how I could afford to have employees
if I couldn't work at my usual level. I chose not to have any. I took
only jobs I could handle by myself or later with day laborers if I just >needed an extra set of hands. That year I was pretty miserable, but I
made more money working by myself than I had ever made before in my
life. That was only a small surprise. The story tells I have some
drive and ambition. I couldn't work as hard as I used to, and by mid >afternoon I was exhausted so I couldn't work as long as I used to
either. I started taking weekends off, because I needed to recover from >pushing myself all week, and I didn't need to work so I could afford to
pay somebody who wasn't. I was working far fewer hours and making more
money than I ever had before. I never had employees ever again, and I
tried very hard to make sure my company was never dependent on any one
other person or company.
My critique of the average person who works for a wage is not cynical.
It was beaten into me by hard won experience.
Hi Bob
Thanks for these words of wisdom.
They come just right at a juncture for me.
I really appreciate.
Rich S
On 4/30/2022 12:56 AM, Richard Smith wrote:
Hi Bob
Thanks for these words of wisdom.
They come just right at a juncture for me.
I really appreciate.
Rich S
My point if anything I guess is that the only person that you know
(mostly) how they will perform without prodding is you. If you want
real safe engineering standards to work from quit bitching about it and
ask for them. Demand them. Express anguish and rending of cloth for
fear of harming a school bus full of children who all plummet to their
death when the bridge you built collapses dumping them all into the
raging rapids and rocks below.
On 4/30/2022 12:56 AM, Richard Smith wrote:
Hi Bob
Thanks for these words of wisdom.
They come just right at a juncture for me.
I really appreciate.
Rich S
My point if anything I guess is that the only person that you know
(mostly) how they will perform without prodding is you. If you want
real safe engineering standards to work from quit bitching about it
and ask for them. Demand them. Express anguish and rending of cloth
for fear of harming a school bus full of children who all plummet to
their death when the bridge you built collapses dumping them all into
the raging rapids and rocks below.
Bob La Londe <none@none.com99> writes:
On 4/30/2022 12:56 AM, Richard Smith wrote:
Hi Bob
Thanks for these words of wisdom.
They come just right at a juncture for me.
I really appreciate.
Rich S
My point if anything I guess is that the only person that you know
(mostly) how they will perform without prodding is you. If you want
real safe engineering standards to work from quit bitching about it
and ask for them. Demand them. Express anguish and rending of cloth
for fear of harming a school bus full of children who all plummet to
their death when the bridge you built collapses dumping them all into
the raging rapids and rocks below.
If only you could see me in action :-)
When welding for an hourly wage I do have to conceal all opinions
though.
Have I got this right? - my point is where I go onwards? Taking it
that gather my knowledge at this juncture and go on up a new fork.
On 5/2/2022 1:39 PM, Richard Smith wrote:
Bob La Londe <none@none.com99> writes:
On 4/30/2022 12:56 AM, Richard Smith wrote:
Hi Bob
Thanks for these words of wisdom.
They come just right at a juncture for me.
I really appreciate.
Rich S
My point if anything I guess is that the only person that you know
(mostly) how they will perform without prodding is you. If you want
real safe engineering standards to work from quit bitching about it
and ask for them. Demand them. Express anguish and rending of cloth
for fear of harming a school bus full of children who all plummet to
their death when the bridge you built collapses dumping them all into
the raging rapids and rocks below.
If only you could see me in action :-)
When welding for an hourly wage I do have to conceal all opinions
though.
Have I got this right? - my point is where I go onwards? Taking it
that gather my knowledge at this juncture and go on up a new fork.
As odd as it may sound my opinions are mostly idealistic up to this juncture. Now you need to decide what's best for you, your family, and those around you. Not just today, but tomorrow, next week, next year,
and the next decade.
Maybe you should consider becoming an engineer, a safety inspector, or
(I do apologize for saying this) a politician.
Maybe (if you can shoulder the burden, and it is a heavy burden) start
your own company and excel by hiring top flight engineers and other
talent, bidding every job, and sending every poorly planned job back
with a list of deficiencies to be corrected before finalizing the bid.
Or keep your mouth shut, feed your family, send your younguns to school,
and hope you don't have to someday shoulder the guilt on your conscience
when a deficiency you knew about goes badly.
I was a contractor for 23 years, and employed in contracting trades for around 30. In my own company if something didn't make sense I sent it
back for correction, but I knew plenty of contractors who looked for deficiencies from a purely mercenary point view. They would bid
marginally low to get the job, and say nothing. Then they price gouged
on change orders to bring the job up to minimum standards when the specs
were not correct. They hated to see me bid against them. I didn't play stupid games. If the spec was dangerous or didn't meet code I sent it
back with a list of known deficiencies and refused to bid until it was good. I also made a point of noting I was not the engineer or designer
and there very well good be issues I did not have the knowledge to know about.
If this is something that really bothers you then you need to put
yourself in a place to change it.
On 5/2/2022 2:33 PM, Bob La Londe wrote:
On 5/2/2022 1:39 PM, Richard Smith wrote:
Bob La Londe <none@none.com99> writes:
On 4/30/2022 12:56 AM, Richard Smith wrote:
Hi Bob
Thanks for these words of wisdom.
They come just right at a juncture for me.
I really appreciate.
Rich S
My point if anything I guess is that the only person that you know
(mostly) how they will perform without prodding is you. If you want
real safe engineering standards to work from quit bitching about it
and ask for them. Demand them. Express anguish and rending of cloth >>>> for fear of harming a school bus full of children who all plummet to
their death when the bridge you built collapses dumping them all into
the raging rapids and rocks below.
If only you could see me in action :-)
When welding for an hourly wage I do have to conceal all opinions
though.
Have I got this right? - my point is where I go onwards? Taking it
that gather my knowledge at this juncture and go on up a new fork.
As odd as it may sound my opinions are mostly idealistic up to this
juncture. Now you need to decide what's best for you, your family,
and those around you. Not just today, but tomorrow, next week, next
year, and the next decade.
Maybe you should consider becoming an engineer, a safety inspector,
or (I do apologize for saying this) a politician.
Maybe (if you can shoulder the burden, and it is a heavy burden)
start your own company and excel by hiring top flight engineers and
other talent, bidding every job, and sending every poorly planned
job back with a list of deficiencies to be corrected before
finalizing the bid.
Or keep your mouth shut, feed your family, send your younguns to
school, and hope you don't have to someday shoulder the guilt on
your conscience when a deficiency you knew about goes badly.
I was a contractor for 23 years, and employed in contracting trades
for around 30. In my own company if something didn't make sense I
sent it back for correction, but I knew plenty of contractors who
looked for deficiencies from a purely mercenary point view. They
would bid marginally low to get the job, and say nothing. Then they
price gouged on change orders to bring the job up to minimum
standards when the specs were not correct. They hated to see me bid
against them. I didn't play stupid games. If the spec was
dangerous or didn't meet code I sent it back with a list of known
deficiencies and refused to bid until it was good. I also made a
point of noting I was not the engineer or designer and there very
well good be issues I did not have the knowledge to know about.
If this is something that really bothers you then you need to put
yourself in a place to change it.
And if you are just having a midlife crisis go buy your self a sports
car and get back to work.
On 5/2/2022 2:33 PM, Bob La Londe wrote:
On 5/2/2022 1:39 PM, Richard Smith wrote:...
Bob La Londe <none@none.com99> writes:
And if you are just having a midlife crisis go buy your self a sports
car and get back to work.
Bob La Londe <none@none.com99> writes:
On 5/2/2022 2:33 PM, Bob La Londe wrote:
On 5/2/2022 1:39 PM, Richard Smith wrote:...
Bob La Londe <none@none.com99> writes:
And if you are just having a midlife crisis go buy your self a sports
car and get back to work.
If I understand myself and my situation correctly...
When everything goes wrong, you "just" work. Whatever gives you
structure.
You let the path take you where it does, and like as not you will
heal.
Of those I know, some have not made it along the path...
I have done that for a lot of years now - working and going
day-by-day.
Then...
I come to this vantage-point.
I suspect this is the same for many.
Out of the pressing-on comes a bigger understanding and everything
falls into place.
That being so - it's my juncture.
So - "midlife crisis" - ???
Quite the opposite?
On 5/3/2022 7:44 AM, Richard Smith wrote:
Bob La Londe <none@none.com99> writes:...
On 5/2/2022 2:33 PM, Bob La Londe wrote:
On 5/2/2022 1:39 PM, Richard Smith wrote:
Bob La Londe <none@none.com99> writes:
... ... You may still die without accomplishing
your goal, ...
If there is a midlife crisis, it's that I made a "final lunge" with a scientific / engineering idea - then came to the feeling that everyone
who is in a research job is doing very nicely thank-you and they don't
want my disruption and "craziness".
The pandemic disruption tipped me down this path, taking away a
safe-haven turn and sending me into more endeavour.
I also recognised I have encountered others before who later on in
life still press for some big idea. Seeking some meaning in life?
The idea is that welds done in conditions welders would choose can
have a cyclic load fatigue endurance about the same as the steels they
are joining (current orthodoxy, incorporated in Standards (Codes), is
that welds have a much lower fatigue endurance than the steels being
joined). I found that accidentally just over 10 years ago, when I
threw a weld as I would make in a "scummy" steel fabrication shop into
a fatigue testing machine. I was tormented by not having the chance
to see how much the result could be repeated - as my time there was
over.
Other big problem though - to scale up the result, if confirmed, to
something like a bridge, you'd have to be able to test full-sized representations of welded structure. Hundreds to thousands of
tonnes-force. Fatigue test - not static.
Not doable. "Show-stopper".
Then - with the pandemic, working in an engineering place doing steel fabrications... The customer demands a "stop" as they evaluate design changes. I use the facilities and materials to try some test ideas.
I realise a static test for fillet weld strength can be scaled-up to
any size with no obvious maximum limit - and that test could become a
fatigue test with the suitable drive / hydraulics.
So the fatigue resistant welds idea can go "live".
I come up with a plan, with stages, finding the way ahead in steps.
Starting with "first confirmation" which can be done on a
servo-hydraulic fatigue testing machine any university or fatigue
testing facility has. Principle confirmed - resonant fatigue testing
in specialist fatigue testing facility, getting out the the 10's and
100's of millions of cycles. Confirmed again at that stage - test
using custom methods on full-sized representations of welded joints in bridges, etc.
I ventured forth with a confident drive I have never had before - okay
as a young man who had found his feet before everythign "blew-up".
Returning to me now.
One poor sod - a Professor at a University here in the UK - returning
several months later I asked with a follow up email about how the
workload was, attaching an image of model representing a cart with
square wheels and everyone heaving away, with speech-bubbles saying
"We haven't got time for that" to a figure holding round wheels. Oddly enough, that didn't elicit a reply... :-)
I got some way, talking with a steel company considered one of the few
most advanced in the World. I also found a Non-Destructive Testing
equipment company who changed their answer from "No" to "Yes" as they explored in their minds what such equipment would need to do. The
"yes" being that they were sure they could make an equipment which
could scan the welds and alert if it did not have the
fatigue-resistant weld characteristic.
But I realised - people, certainly here, go into streams largely
dependent on social background, and get remunerated accordingly. So I
was being this madman in the wilderness intruding in their comfortable
world and scaring them.
I worked in the US - back in 2001 - not the most fortuituous time -
and found people much more outward-looking and entrepreneurial.
Context reality - there is space and resources in North America which
we don't have. So there is space for visionaries to "spread their
wings". ?? (eg. Elon Musk now; Steve Jobs before; etc.)
We in Europe need to work harder to compensate for being
shoulder-to-shoulder - and that doesn't seem as true as it should be.
So anyway, as far as I can recognise, that is my midlife crisis - but
equally it could be said to have been a good way to throw myself into something which enabled me to come out the other side of the pandemic
crisis riding high and upright, closer to being as wise as I should
be.
So - there you have it.
Bob - my "mid-life crisis" as much as I recognise it.
On 5/3/2022 6:59 PM, Richard Smith wrote:
...
I do hope you realize I was as much being a smart ass as asking you to
delve into self analysis.
On 5/3/2022 7:44 AM, Richard Smith wrote:
Bob La Londe <none@none.com99> writes:
On 5/2/2022 2:33 PM, Bob La Londe wrote:
On 5/2/2022 1:39 PM, Richard Smith wrote:...
Bob La Londe <none@none.com99> writes:
And if you are just having a midlife crisis go buy your self a sports
car and get back to work.
If I understand myself and my situation correctly...
When everything goes wrong, you "just" work. Whatever gives you
structure.
You let the path take you where it does, and like as not you will
heal.
Of those I know, some have not made it along the path...
I have done that for a lot of years now - working and going
day-by-day.
Then...
I come to this vantage-point.
I suspect this is the same for many.
Out of the pressing-on comes a bigger understanding and everything
falls into place.
That being so - it's my juncture.
So - "midlife crisis" - ???
Quite the opposite?
It sounds like one of my other platitudes there.Forget about taking the bull by the horns, use a shovel!
When things look tough, you are overwhelmed, you don't know what to do
first. When All seems hopeless. All you can do it step in and keep >swinging. Back into a corner by thugs who intend your demise when you
have no path to retreat. When jobs are piling up one after another.
When you have a ditch to dig or a pile of manure to move. Step in and
keep swinging. You may still die without accomplishing your goal, but
it will not be quite as bad for the man or child behind you.
Bob La Londe <none@none.com99> writes:
On 5/2/2022 2:33 PM, Bob La Londe wrote:
On 5/2/2022 1:39 PM, Richard Smith wrote:...
Bob La Londe <none@none.com99> writes:
And if you are just having a midlife crisis go buy your self a sports
car and get back to work.
If I understand myself and my situation correctly...
When everything goes wrong, you "just" work. Whatever gives you
structure.
You let the path take you where it does, and like as not you will
heal.
Of those I know, some have not made it along the path...
I have done that for a lot of years now - working and going
day-by-day.
Then...
I come to this vantage-point.
I suspect this is the same for many.
Out of the pressing-on comes a bigger understanding and everything
falls into place.
That being so - it's my juncture.
So - "midlife crisis" - ???
Quite the opposite?
On Tue, 3 May 2022 08:28:05 -0700, Bob La Londe <none@none.com99>Or a 4X4 across the horns (or the stones if you can reach them!!!!)
wrote:
On 5/3/2022 7:44 AM, Richard Smith wrote:Forget about taking the bull by the horns, use a shovel!
Bob La Londe <none@none.com99> writes:
On 5/2/2022 2:33 PM, Bob La Londe wrote:
On 5/2/2022 1:39 PM, Richard Smith wrote:...
Bob La Londe <none@none.com99> writes:
And if you are just having a midlife crisis go buy your self a sports
car and get back to work.
If I understand myself and my situation correctly...
When everything goes wrong, you "just" work. Whatever gives you
structure.
You let the path take you where it does, and like as not you will
heal.
Of those I know, some have not made it along the path...
I have done that for a lot of years now - working and going
day-by-day.
Then...
I come to this vantage-point.
I suspect this is the same for many.
Out of the pressing-on comes a bigger understanding and everything
falls into place.
That being so - it's my juncture.
So - "midlife crisis" - ???
Quite the opposite?
It sounds like one of my other platitudes there.
When things look tough, you are overwhelmed, you don't know what to do >>first. When All seems hopeless. All you can do it step in and keep >>swinging. Back into a corner by thugs who intend your demise when you
have no path to retreat. When jobs are piling up one after another.
When you have a ditch to dig or a pile of manure to move. Step in and
keep swinging. You may still die without accomplishing your goal, but
it will not be quite as bad for the man or child behind you.
"Richard Smith" wrote in message news:lyczglvnif.fsf@void.com...
More on my point about absence of quality control - seemingly a
totally similar instance in a totally independent other case.
https://www.scotsman.com/news/transport/oil-firm-cmi-offshore-reveals-totally-misplaced-confidence-in-ferguson-marine-shipyard-after-botched-barge-order-3684544
"CMI Offshore told Scotland on Sunday that the yard – which is
building two massively late and over-budget CalMac ferries – had
'extremely low productivity and quality control' and said much of the
work on the barge had to be redone.
One maritime source said: "If they can't build a steel box [the
barge], they can't build a ferry.""
...
-------------------------
Elon Musk @elonmusk·May 6
"I strongly believe that all managers in a technical area must be
technically excellent.
Managers in software must write great software or it’s like being a
cavalry captain who can’t ride a horse!"
"Richard Smith" wrote in message news:lyczglvnif.fsf@void.com... ----------------
Governments must seek fairness, social equity, which is incompatible
with personal excellence. That's why socialism always falls behind.
https://scientificgems.wordpress.com/2017/09/12/the-r100-and-the-r101/
"Richard Smith" wrote in message news:lyczglvnif.fsf@void.com...
More on my point about absence of quality control - seemingly a
totally similar instance in a totally independent other case.
https://www.scotsman.com/news/transport/oil-firm-cmi-offshore-reveals-totally-misplaced-confidence-in-ferguson-marine-shipyard-after-botched-barge-order-3684544
"CMI Offshore told Scotland on Sunday that the yard – which is
building two massively late and over-budget CalMac ferries – had
'extremely low productivity and quality control' and said much of the
work on the barge had to be redone.
One maritime source said: "If they can't build a steel box [the
barge], they can't build a ferry.""
...
-------------------------
Elon Musk @elonmusk·May 6
"I strongly believe that all managers in a technical area must be
technically excellent.
Managers in software must write great software or it’s like being a
cavalry captain who can’t ride a horse!"
The central tenet of management is that you must be managerialThe central tenet of management is you must have a functioning brain
material (sic.), surely?
More on my point about absence of quality control - seemingly a
totally similar instance in a totally independent other case.
https://www.scotsman.com/news/transport/oil-firm-cmi-offshore-reveals-totally-misplaced-confidence-in-ferguson-marine-shipyard-after-botched-barge-order-3684544
"CMI Offshore told Scotland on Sunday that the yard – which is
building two massively late and over-budget CalMac ferries – had
'extremely low productivity and quality control' and said much of the
work on the barge had to be redone.
One maritime source said: "If they can't build a steel box [the
barge], they can't build a ferry.""
and again
"However, Richard Keisner, managing director of Mangistau ACV
Solutions, part of CMI, said: 'Our experience at the ...
shipyard was affected by a shortage of direct labour throughout,
which seemed to move from one vessel under construction to another,
which was combined with extremely low productivity and quality
control.'"
I read that as being total lack of plan. I include absence of quality >control in that characterisation.
Here in Britain we had in the 1960's "killed by accountants".
W Edwards Deming was right - "Concentrate on costs and your costs will
tend to rise. Concentrate on quality and your costs will tend to
fall".
My own philosophy - "Costs are fairly immutable, and most efforts to
trim one cost will cause other costs to spike, result nett worse-off.
Profits are unbounded - they can be whatever you can make them - so
the maximum effort needs to be on profits."
For sure, very competent cost control is needed. That is part of the >analytic one mind of a well run company.
So, as the world situation made life less easy for British
manufacturing, bringing in accountants to run businesses lead to their
rapid demise. Accounts see only incurred costs - not how to generate >profits. That isn't part of their world and their ideology.
Having no quality control in a manufacturing environment, particularly
with welding - well, it's difficult to make any helpful comment on
this total absence of underdstanding and ability.
Regards,
Rich Smith
"Jim Wilkins" <muratlanne@gmail.com> writes:The central tenet of management is you must have a functioning brain
"Richard Smith" wrote in message news:lyczglvnif.fsf@void.com...
More on my point about absence of quality control - seemingly a
totally similar instance in a totally independent other case.
https://www.scotsman.com/news/transport/oil-firm-cmi-offshore-reveals-totally-misplaced-confidence-in-ferguson-marine-shipyard-after-botched-barge-order-3684544
"CMI Offshore told Scotland on Sunday that the yard – which is
building two massively late and over-budget CalMac ferries – had
'extremely low productivity and quality control' and said much of the
work on the barge had to be redone.
One maritime source said: "If they can't build a steel box [the
barge], they can't build a ferry.""
...
-------------------------
Elon Musk @elonmusk·May 6
"I strongly believe that all managers in a technical area must be
technically excellent.
Managers in software must write great software or it’s like being a
cavalry captain who can’t ride a horse!"
:-)
"What is needed is competent managers, skilled and experienced in
managerial skills, and clear structures of management.
It has been correctly realised that ..."
You could get slid out of the door on any of a range of substitute
pretexts for saying what you have just said, surely?
The central tenet of management is that you must be managerial
material (sic.), surely?
On Tue, 10 May 2022 15:23:55 +0100, Richard Smith <null@void.com>
...The central tenet of management is you must have a functioning brain
"Clare Snyder" wrote in message
...
And make decisions at the upper end of the spinal cord.
"Clare Snyder" wrote in message
...
And make decisions at the upper end of the spinal cord.
On Tue, 10 May 2022 15:23:55 +0100, Richard Smith <null@void.com>
...The central tenet of management is you must have a functioning brain
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