On 28/09/2024 7:59 am, *skriptis wrote:

https://youtube.com/watch?v=5doKiR_v6oM&si=dE5vhkfCES2xs0wC

It's a short clip, Djokovic in Serbian with English subtitles.

The clip is far more interesting than the title would suggest.

You get to hear him in original too.

I still think he should have kept quiet and stayed off social media
until he played his 1st rd match. Most likely would have snuck in
without anyone really paying attention. It was an election year and he
pissed off a lot of people who were suffering under harsh lock down
conditions, so became political quickly. Tough to win against rule
makers when they're trying to win an election and think they can gain votes.

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Whisper <whisper@ozemail.com.au> Wrote in message:r

On 28/09/2024 7:59 am, *skriptis wrote:> https://youtube.com/watch?v=5doKiR_v6oM&si=dE5vhkfCES2xs0wC> > > It's a short clip, Djokovic in Serbian with English subtitles.> > The clip is far more interesting than the title would suggest.> > You get to

hear him in original too.> > I still think he should have kept quiet and stayed off social media until he played his 1st rd match. Most likely would have snuck in without anyone really paying attention. It was an election year and he pissed off a lot
of people who were suffering under harsh lock down conditions, so became political quickly. Tough to win against rule makers when they're trying to win an election and think they can gain votes.


I really fail to see how would that help?

Maybe it would, but he really did nothing wrong, just announced he's playing in Australia?

I mean, I get your point but I'm trying to say this. At best, staying quiet and off the social media, would have given him 2-3 days of being under the radar. Maximum.

Then what?

He'd still have to talk about it at his first pre tournament press conference.

It would still be a week or more before the tournament.

You don't think same things would happen?






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On 30/09/2024 3:39 am, *skriptis wrote:

Whisper <whisper@ozemail.com.au> Wrote in message:r

On 28/09/2024 7:59 am, *skriptis wrote:> https://youtube.com/watch?v=5doKiR_v6oM&si=dE5vhkfCES2xs0wC> > > It's a short clip, Djokovic in Serbian with English subtitles.> > The clip is far more interesting than the title would suggest.> > You get to

hear him in original too.> > I still think he should have kept quiet and stayed off social media until he played his 1st rd match. Most likely would have snuck in without anyone really paying attention. It was an election year and he pissed off a lot
of people who were suffering under harsh lock down conditions, so became political quickly. Tough to win against rule makers when they're trying to win an election and think they can gain votes.

I really fail to see how would that help?

Maybe it would, but he really did nothing wrong, just announced he's playing in Australia?

I mean, I get your point but I'm trying to say this. At best, staying quiet and off the social media, would have given him 2-3 days of being under the radar. Maximum.

Then what?

He'd still have to talk about it at his first pre tournament press conference.

It would still be a week or more before the tournament.

You don't think same things would happen?

I really don't. All Novak had to say when asked was 'no comment, tennis questions only'. I remember a lot of my non tennis friends were invested
in this topic and many weren't even sure who Novak was, but they cared
big time about the elite having special rules while the rest suffered.
Novak was boasting big time on social media, should have done the
opposite and said nothing. Tilley had already snuck him through the
back door before it all blew up. Anyway it's a lesson that even the rich/privileged shouldn't push it too far. Politicians make the rules
and they'll do whatever they think will gain them votes.

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On 1.10.2024 11.39, Whisper wrote:

On 30/09/2024 3:39 am, *skriptis wrote:

Whisper <whisper@ozemail.com.au> Wrote in message:r

On 28/09/2024 7:59 am, *skriptis wrote:>
https://youtube.com/watch?v=5doKiR_v6oM&si=dE5vhkfCES2xs0wC> > > It's
a short clip, Djokovic in Serbian with English subtitles.> > The clip
is far more interesting than the title would suggest.> > You get to
hear him in original too.> > I still think he should have kept quiet
and stayed off social media until he played his 1st rd match.  Most
likely would have snuck in without anyone really paying attention.
It was an election year and he pissed off a lot of people who were
suffering under harsh lock down conditions, so became political
quickly.  Tough to win against rule makers when they're trying to win
an election and think they can gain votes.

I really fail to see how would that help?

Maybe it would, but he really did nothing wrong, just announced he's
playing in Australia?

I mean, I get your point but I'm trying to say this. At best, staying
quiet and off the social media, would have given him 2-3 days of being
under the radar. Maximum.

Then what?

He'd still have to talk about it at his first pre tournament press
conference.

It would still be a week or more before the tournament.

You don't think same things would happen?

I really don't.  All Novak had to say when asked was 'no comment, tennis questions only'. I remember a lot of my non tennis friends were invested
in this topic and many weren't even sure who Novak was, but they cared
big time about the elite having special rules while the rest suffered.
Novak was boasting big time on social media, should have done the
opposite and said nothing.

Yeah. Djok let the hubris catch up to him. He shouldn't have positioned
himself as some kind of a victorious anti-whatever advocate. That made
him the lightning rod while two others that had taken the same exemption
route were already practicing in Melbourne.

At the time, with the goat chase being where it was, it was the dumbest
thing to do. B-a-a. It still is. Djok was treated badly, but he should
now be able to acknowledge the part he played in it rather than get
worked up about it in TV shows years after. This could be a defect in
the mould.

Tilley had already snuck him through the
back door before it all blew up.  Anyway it's a lesson that even the rich/privileged shouldn't push it too far.  Politicians make the rules
and they'll do whatever they think will gain them votes.

A pretty good summary of it all.

--
"And off they went, from here to there,
The bear, the bear, and the maiden fair"
-- Traditional

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On 1/10/2024 10:06 pm, Pelle Svanslös wrote:

On 1.10.2024 11.39, Whisper wrote:

On 30/09/2024 3:39 am, *skriptis wrote:


I really don't.  All Novak had to say when asked was 'no comment,
tennis questions only'. I remember a lot of my non tennis friends were
invested in this topic and many weren't even sure who Novak was, but
they cared big time about the elite having special rules while the
rest suffered. Novak was boasting big time on social media, should
have done the opposite and said nothing.

Yeah. Djok let the hubris catch up to him. He shouldn't have positioned himself as some kind of a victorious anti-whatever advocate. That made
him the lightning rod while two others that had taken the same exemption route were already practicing in Melbourne.

At the time, with the goat chase being where it was, it was the dumbest
thing to do. B-a-a. It still is. Djok was treated badly, but he should
now be able to acknowledge the part he played in it rather than get
worked up about it in TV shows years after. This could be a defect in
the mould.

Tilley had already snuck him through the back door before it all blew
up.  Anyway it's a lesson that even the rich/privileged shouldn't push
it too far.  Politicians make the rules and they'll do whatever they
think will gain them votes.

A pretty good summary of it all.

Novak is not an idiot and wouldn't make the same mistake twice, just unfortunate it cost him a great chance at another slam title. Great for
Rafa who ended up as stand alone slam king twice, at 21 and 22 slams.
Would never have happened if Novak won that AO. He's used to getting
his own way in the tennis world, has been an elite since a teen so
doesn't know any different than administrators bending over backwards to accommodate him, eg even here with Tilley getting him in initially.
Novak didn't really appreciate his influence would disappear once taken
out of the tennis arena. I remember thinking 'Don't poke the bear
Novak', non-tennis people couldn't give a fuck about your tennis status.

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Whisper <whisper@ozemail.com.au> Wrote in message:r

On 1/10/2024 10:06 pm, Pelle Svanslös wrote:> On 1.10.2024 11.39, Whisper wrote:>> On 30/09/2024 3:39 am, *skriptis wrote:>>>>>> I really don't. All Novak had to say when asked was 'no comment, >> tennis questions only'. I remember a lot of my non

tennis friends were >> invested in this topic and many weren't even sure who Novak was, but >> they cared big time about the elite having special rules while the >> rest suffered. Novak was boasting big time on social media, should >> have done the
opposite and said nothing. > > Yeah. Djok let the hubris catch up to him. He shouldn't have positioned > himself as some kind of a victorious anti-whatever advocate. That made > him the lightning rod while two others that had taken the same exemption >
route were already practicing in Melbourne.> > At the time, with the goat chase being where it was, it was the dumbest > thing to do. B-a-a. It still is. Djok was treated badly, but he should > now be able to acknowledge the part he played in it rather
than get > worked up about it in TV shows years after. This could be a defect in > the mould.> >> Tilley had already snuck him through the back door before it all blew >> up. Anyway it's a lesson that even the rich/privileged shouldn't push >> it too
far. Politicians make the rules and they'll do whatever they >> think will gain them votes.> > A pretty good summary of it all.> Novak is not an idiot and wouldn't make the same mistake twice, just unfortunate it cost him a great chance at another slam
title. Great for Rafa who ended up as stand alone slam king twice, at 21 and 22 slams. Would never have happened if Novak won that AO. He's used to getting his own way in the tennis world, has been an elite since a teen so doesn't know any different
than administrators bending over backwards to accommodate him, eg even here with Tilley getting him in initially. Novak didn't really appreciate his influence would disappear once taken out of the tennis arena. I remember thinking 'Don't poke the bear
Novak', non-tennis people couldn't give a fuck about your tennis status.



I'm baffled by the cultural differences.


We don't agree on the events, so let's put vaxx issues aside, you talk about him being privileged?

I'm all against "privileges", e.g. great tennis players milking the tour and exploiting the lesser ones (appearance fees being the prime example, why not make fixed number of tournaments mandatory so that all those tournaments can increase prise money to
give to the players who earn it on court. As it is now, #1 will get million or two just to show up in some ATP500 or even ATP250 while the tournament will award winner far less than that. So I'm against "privileges").


But I think that it goes without saying that Djokovic (and all tennis athletes) are privileged. He was visiting Australia officially, to play in the International Tennis Federation's Official Championship.

He wasn't visiting his aunt privately or even doing some personal bussines, e.g. promoting his company.

If that was the case, I couldn't care less and perhaps I'd even agree with you.


But he was there to play in Australian international championships. He wasn't there for himself only, but for you as well.

Of course both him and others MUST be treated favourably and Australia must accommodate them properly if they're to honour their part of the bargain, which is the prestige of having such an event.

Athletes are indeed elite in this case, just as are e.g. foreign diplomats.

This tennis championships has been equivalent to the Olympics. It's an international sporting event.

You think it's OK for any government to interfere in such ways in sports? And especially in those times with goat debates on the line?

What if China banned Michael Phelps in 2008 from entering China?

They easily could have done it, I think he was known weed smoker even then? China could have said "bad influence on our youth".

But they didn't because it would have been moronic and unworthy. And they'd likely would have lost chance for future major events.


The arrogance which Australian government and even the people showed is astonishing.

They think it's set in stone that AO must be grand slam tournament?

Why?


I totally changed my oppinion on Australia and the people there. My first gut reaction to Australia is mostly negative nowadays.

I mean, I get that they felt abused by their government, but their reaction was of envious pricks, they cheered for their government not to stop abusing them, but for their government to abuse others, foreigners and in this case, foreigners that
government shouldn't have touched, as AO participants did deserve the so called "special treatment".

If you don't give "special treatment" to participants in an international event you're holding, and you even cherry pick whom you want to abuse or not, then you don't deserve to hold such an event.


So even if Djokovic had no papers, he should have been allowed. But of course, he had all, and was allowed to enter Australia when that board checked his medical papers anonymously. They let him in without knowing who he was. So what kind of "special
treatment" was that?

It's beyond absurd what happened in the end.





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https://youtube.com/watch?v=5doKiR_v6oM&si=dE5vhkfCES2xs0wC


It's a short clip, Djokovic in Serbian with English subtitles.

The clip is far more interesting than the title would suggest.

You get to hear him in original too.


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--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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Whisper <whisper@ozemail.com.au> Wrote in message:

Covid was an extreme period in history, decisions taken at the time can look strange in hindsight. Of course when going through it in real time most people listen to doctors and the medical profession. It's the normal and logical option. What's the

alternative really, listen to yotube influencers : )



I don't think anyone listen to "YouTube influencers". You do?

YouTube influencers are merely people who were parroting certain views on vax that were sceptical. They were minority, most of YouTube influencers alongside with mainstream media and politicians were parroting pro vax propaganda.

When Biden or Trump say "get vaxxed" you think they're experts?

Of course they're not.

Point being, anti-vax views were coming from the minority of EXPERTS who were cut off from the media.

Their views and reasonings were parroted by unknown YouTubers same as other YouTube influencers and Biden and CNN were parroting pro vax views.


So the whole thing with "YouTube influencers" is bit overstretched.

Aside from that Australia does have a 'tall poppy syndrome' where we don't admire boastful attitudes.

But Djokovic didn't boast and he didn't get anything that your law and protocols didn't allow for.

As you've seen, several tennis players entered Australia on the same grounds week before him, Czech female player even played in some WTA tournament. And then she got deported later once Djokovic was deported too.

The "boasting" in this whole case certainly couldn't be found on his side, I'd say Australia was a tall poppy in this case.

Quiet champions like Laver, Borg, Edberg etc are much loved and admired because everyone can see they're great, don't need the players telling us they're great.

So you don't like Mohammad Ali or Trump or Ruby Rhod?

I'm not. They bring in the big $$ and are special. If they don't get the extra $$ some administrator/investor gets more. If lesser players want the same privilege then they need to work harder and become better players. It's a democratic system, by

and large.


There's nothing democratic in #1 receiving 2 millions appearance fee, and tournament champion receiving 0.3 millions.

Money that was spent (bribe really) on #1 and given to him under the table could have been spent on proper tournament prize money, attracting overall better players and bolstering competition and allowing lesser player to reach financial stability and
progress faster and better.

Luckily at least we have dozen plus mandatory tournaments to avoid such unfair practices.

But overall, this is weak spot of tennis.

I think Novak should have been allowed to play. I could see he was going to be kicked out - it didn't have to happen, should have gone 'no comment' mode. He would have been into 2nd week before anyone knew what was going on.

Yeah, that was my original question but as you've seen, the Czech player(s) were deported weeks after they had entered Australia and played in tournaments.

Having seen what happened to Czechs, my point is that it was unavoidable.

Your point is that Djokovic's Instagram message "looking forward to Australia" is what set things in motion.


Let's agree to disagree.

Smoking weed is not the same as flouting health regulations that effect millions.

We're running in circles.

I thought we settled for the truth?

Djokovic wasn't deported because he broke any rule or flout anything.

He even won court case.


He was deported by your government simply because governments can do it. They extrapolated that Djokovic not being particularly pro-vax and a visible public persona who is not vaxxed is damaging to their oppressive regime.

So even though Djokovic broke no rules, he was provoking them with their presence so they kicked him out.

That's why I disagree with you on saying "he should have stayed mum".

It was never about anything he said, rather, what he was turned into, a symbol for freedom. Vaxxers did that to him, even though he didn't want it, he minded his own business, he was pussy-like neutral, never said anything such as "hey people, don't take
these shots" or stuff like that.



That's why I took Phelps comparison. Chinese government could have likewise disliked Phelps as he was a weed smoker and said, we don't want this guy in our country, he sets bad example for our kids.

And then there would be no 20 or how many gold medals for him.

If millions of people are forced to take vax and isolate for 4 months straight they aren't going to be happy watching privileged public figures like Novak blatantly flout the rules.

Again, he satisfied your rules, that you set. As did those other tennis players. Who were all later kicked out with Djokovic.

You didn't know to play by the rules, he did.

At least in USO case, it was clear from the start that previously having COVID is not enough to get medical exemption to enter USA so Djokovic didn't even try.

Americans were at least clear.

Millions would have done what Novak did, but didn't have the option.

What do you mean by that, millions would have come to Australia using medical exemption? That's what you said?

But I know you mean "millions would not have taken the vaccine", right?

Well. If that's the case, you should have fought for your rights, not cheer to abuse the others who are free.




https://youtube.com/shorts/wzP8mcbiKMY?si=Ty1xncGULOR57T-U




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On 5/10/2024 7:21 pm, *skriptis wrote:

jdeluise <jdeluise@gmail.com> Wrote in message:rcountry. They call the shots. It's none of your business "to agree or disagree" with anything. I hope I'm being clear on this. It's like me saying "I don't agree with US gun laws or second

amendment". It's bizarre thing to say for a foreigner. ... But still, Brazil is the country so I'm on their side. We have to always be nationalists.

You have reading and comprehension issues.

Of course you won't post anything factual, just your standard beta bitch whining "hah I caught you in hypocrisy".

For some reason you think you've won all arguments when you do that, it's hilarious, reality check you win none, you're laughing stock when you do that.

: )

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

jdeluise <jdeluise@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r

*skriptis <skriptis@post.t-com.hr> writes:> Whisper <whisper@ozemail.com.au> Wrote in message:>> Covid was an extreme period in history, decisions taken at the >> time can look strange in hindsight. Of course when going >> through it in real time most

people listen to doctors and the >> medical profession. It's the normal and logical option. >> What's the alternative really, listen to yotube influencers : )>>>> I don't think anyone listen to "YouTube influencers". You do?>> YouTube influencers are
merely people who were parroting certain > views on vax that were sceptical. They were minority, most of > YouTube influencers alongside with mainstream media and > politicians were parroting pro vax propaganda.>> When Biden or Trump say "get vaxxed" you
think they're experts?>> Of course they're not.>> Point being, anti-vax views were coming from the minority of > EXPERTS who were cut off from the media.>> Their views and reasonings were parroted by unknown YouTubers > same as other YouTube influencers
and Biden and CNN were > parroting pro vax views.>>> So the whole thing with "YouTube influencers" is bit > overstretched.>>>>>>>>>> Aside from that Australia does have a 'tall poppy syndrome' >> where we don't admire boastful attitudes.>>> But Djokovic
didn't boast and he didn't get anything that your > law and protocols didn't allow for.>> As you've seen, several tennis players entered Australia on the > same grounds week before him, Czech female player even played in > some WTA tournament. And then
she got deported later once > Djokovic was deported too.>> The "boasting" in this whole case certainly couldn't be found on > his side, I'd say Australia was a tall poppy in this case.>>>>>>>> Quiet champions like Laver, Borg, Edberg etc are much loved
and >> admired because everyone can see they're great, don't need the >> players telling us they're great.>>> So you don't like Mohammad Ali or Trump or Ruby Rhod? >>>>>>> I'm not. They bring in the big $$ and are special. If they >> don't get the
extra $$ some administrator/investor gets more. >> If lesser players want the same privilege then they need to >> work harder and become better players. It's a democratic >> system, by and large.>>> There's nothing democratic in #1 receiving 2 millions
appearance > fee, and tournament champion receiving 0.3 millions.>> Money that was spent (bribe really) on #1 and given to him under > the table could have been spent on proper tournament prize > money, attracting overall better players and bolstering >
competition and allowing lesser player to reach financial > stability and progress faster and better.>> Luckily at least we have dozen plus mandatory tournaments to > avoid such unfair practices. >> But overall, this is weak spot of tennis.>>>>>>>>>> I
think Novak should have been allowed to play. I could see he >> was going to be kicked out - it didn't have to happen, should >> have gone 'no comment' mode. He would have been into 2nd week >> before anyone knew what was going on.>>> Yeah, that was my
original question but as you've seen, the > Czech player(s) were deported weeks after they had entered > Australia and played in tournaments.>> Having seen what happened to Czechs, my point is that it was > unavoidable.>> Your point is that Djokovic's
Instagram message "looking forward > to Australia" is what set things in motion.>>> Let's agree to disagree.>>>>>>>>> Smoking weed is not the same as flouting health regulations >> that effect millions.>>> We're running in circles.>> I thought we settled
for the truth?>> Djokovic wasn't deported because he broke any rule or flout > anything.>> He even won court case.>>> He was deported by your government simply because governments > can do it. They extrapolated that Djokovic not being > particularly pro-
vax and a visible public persona who is not > vaxxed is damaging to their oppressive regime.>> So even though Djokovic broke no rules, he was provoking them > with their presence so they kicked him out.>> That's why I disagree with you on saying "he
should have stayed > mum".>> It was never about anything he said, rather, what he was turned > into, a symbol for freedom. Vaxxers did that to him, even though > he didn't want it, he minded his own business, he was pussy-like > neutral, never said
anything such as "hey people, don't take > these shots" or stuff like that.>>>> That's why I took Phelps comparison. Chinese government could > have likewise disliked Phelps as he was a weed smoker and said, > we don't want this guy in our country, he
sets bad example for > our kids.>> And then there would be no 20 or how many gold medals for him.>>>>>>>> If millions of people are forced to take vax and isolate for 4 >> months straight they aren't going to be happy watching >> privileged public
figures like Novak blatantly flout the rules.>>> Again, he satisfied your rules, that you set. As did those other > tennis players. Who were all later kicked out with Djokovic.>> You didn't know to play by the rules, he did.>> At least in USO case, it
was clear from the start that > previously having COVID is not enough to get medical exemption > to enter USA so Djokovic didn't even try.>> Americans were at least clear.>>>>>>>>>>> Millions would have done what Novak did, but didn't have the >> option.>

What do you mean by that, millions would have come to Australia > using medical exemption? That's what you said?>> But I know you mean "millions would not have taken the vaccine", > right?>> Well. If that's the case, you should have fought for your >

rights, not cheer to abuse the others who are free.>>>>> https://youtube.com/shorts/wzP8mcbiKMY?si=Ty1xncGULOR57T-UAnyone remember when *skript wrote this a couple weeks ago? But Brazil is a state. A country. They call the shots. It's none of your
business "to agree or disagree" with anything. I hope I'm being clear on this. It's like me saying "I don't agree with US gun laws or second amendment". It's bizarre thing to say for a foreigner. ... But still, Brazil is the country so I'm on
their side. We have to always be nationalists.




You have reading and comprehension issues.

Of course you won't post anything factual, just your standard beta bitch whining "hah I caught you in hypocrisy".

For some reason you think you've won all arguments when you do that, it's hilarious, reality check you win none, you're laughing stock when you do that.



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On 5/10/2024 6:40 pm, *skriptis wrote:

Whisper <whisper@ozemail.com.au> Wrote in message:

Aside from that Australia does have a 'tall poppy syndrome' where we don't admire boastful attitudes.

But Djokovic didn't boast and he didn't get anything that your law and protocols didn't allow for.

As you've seen, several tennis players entered Australia on the same grounds week before him, Czech female player even played in some WTA tournament. And then she got deported later once Djokovic was >deported too.

The "boasting" in this whole case certainly couldn't be found on his side, I'd say Australia was a tall poppy in this case.

He was posting bulging biceps emojis and 'Idemo!' etc. I personally
liked it but could see he was taking unnecessary risks.

Quiet champions like Laver, Borg, Edberg etc are much loved and admired because everyone can see they're great, don't need the players telling us they're great.

So you don't like Mohammad Ali or Trump or Ruby Rhod?

I like them all, I'm referring to the typical Australian culture. I
don't agree with it but know it well.

I'm not. They bring in the big $$ and are special. If they don't get the extra $$ some administrator/investor gets more. If lesser players want the same privilege then they need to work harder and become better players. It's a democratic system, by

and large.

There's nothing democratic in #1 receiving 2 millions appearance fee, and tournament champion receiving 0.3 millions.

But the opportunity is there for any player to become no.1 and win
slams, that's the democratic bit. Billionaires like Pegula and Navarro
have not won slams despite their extreme wealth.

Money that was spent (bribe really) on #1 and given to him under the table could have been spent on proper tournament prize money, attracting overall better players and bolstering competition and allowing lesser player to reach financial stability and

progress faster and better.

Luckily at least we have dozen plus mandatory tournaments to avoid such unfair practices.

But overall, this is weak spot of tennis.

But they sell the tickets and generate the most interest.

I think Novak should have been allowed to play. I could see he was going to be kicked out - it didn't have to happen, should have gone 'no comment' mode. He would have been into 2nd week before anyone knew what was going on.

Yeah, that was my original question but as you've seen, the Czech player(s) were deported weeks after they had entered Australia and played in tournaments.

Having seen what happened to Czechs, my point is that it was unavoidable.

They only got kicked out after the Novak thing blew up.

Your point is that Djokovic's Instagram message "looking forward to Australia" is what set things in motion.

Let's agree to disagree.

If he stayed off social media and didn't talk about covid I'm certain he
would have played and had high chance of winning. Of course this
doesn't necessarily mean he would have more than 24 slams today as the
enforced breaks may have helped him win later slams he may have
otherwise lost.

Smoking weed is not the same as flouting health regulations that effect millions.

We're running in circles.

I thought we settled for the truth?

Djokovic wasn't deported because he broke any rule or flout anything.

He even won court case.

Shouldn't have even gone that far. Once the politicians saw votes he
was a shot duck no matter what the judges rule.

He was deported by your government simply because governments can do it. They extrapolated that Djokovic not being particularly pro-vax and a visible public persona who is not vaxxed is damaging to their oppressive regime.

So even though Djokovic broke no rules, he was provoking them with their presence so they kicked him out.

Exactly. He underestimated his influence, doesn't extend much outside
tennis arena.

That's why I disagree with you on saying "he should have stayed mum".

It was never about anything he said, rather, what he was turned into, a symbol for freedom. Vaxxers did that to him, even though he didn't want it, he minded his own business, he was pussy-like neutral, never said anything such as "hey people, don't

take these shots" or stuff like that.



He has a history of flouting the rules, eg that tournament he hosted in
Croatia with zero social distancing rules etc and everyone got sick.
Not a good look for a neutral stance.

That's why I took Phelps comparison. Chinese government could have likewise disliked Phelps as he was a weed smoker and said, we don't want this guy in our country, he sets bad example for our kids.

And then there would be no 20 or how many gold medals for him.

Look I personally don't agree with how he was treated, but he shot
himself in the foot with how it all looked to suffering Australians. He
was never going to win that fight in a country like Australia or USA.

If millions of people are forced to take vax and isolate for 4 months straight they aren't going to be happy watching privileged public figures like Novak blatantly flout the rules.

Again, he satisfied your rules, that you set. As did those other tennis players. Who were all later kicked out with Djokovic.

You didn't know to play by the rules, he did.

At least in USO case, it was clear from the start that previously having COVID is not enough to get medical exemption to enter USA so Djokovic didn't even try.

Americans were at least clear.

So you see Australia did actually try and succeeded in getting him in -
great job by Tilley. Just needed Novak to keep mum so people had to
guess at his stance, most wouldn't have cared in that case.

Millions would have done what Novak did, but didn't have the option.

What do you mean by that, millions would have come to Australia using medical exemption? That's what you said?

I mean millions took the vax to keep their jobs and gain other
privileges, else they wouldn't have. They saw Novak getting away with
it, an elite with special rules etc. Bad look.

But I know you mean "millions would not have taken the vaccine", right?

Yep

Well. If that's the case, you should have fought for your rights, not cheer to abuse the others who are free.

It was a strange time in history, no time to settle arguments in
absolute terms, just follow the medical advice and do what our leaders
say.

Anyway end of the day it may have been a positive outcome for Novak. He
want past Fed/Nadal in slam race and even won gold medal this year.
This may or may not have happened had he played all the way through with
no breaks to recharge etc. Nobody knows.

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Whisper <whisper@ozemail.com.au> Wrote in message:

He was posting bulging biceps emojis and 'Idemo!' etc. I personally liked it but could see he was taking unnecessary risks.

Let's say he didn't do that at all.

He'd still be at some press conference pre-tournament and he'd get asked whether he was vaxxed.

He'd have answered honestly and same shit would have happened.

If he stayed off social media and didn't talk about covid I'm certain he would have played and had high chance of winning. Of course this doesn't necessarily mean he would have more than 24 slams today as the enforced breaks may have helped him win

later slams he may have otherwise lost.


Yeah, no point in counting "potential slams".

We've seen his motivation plummets after achieving major goals.

CGS and FO in 2016, bottom rock afterwards.

So logically, slam record, CGS record and now Olympics means he's drained and would have been earlier had he achieved them sooner.

He has a history of flouting the rules, eg that tournament he hosted in Croatia with zero social distancing rules etc and everyone got sick.

Now that's total bullshit and again, I'm baffled by the cultural differences. I've seen this being used against him many times in western media.

What does he have to do with that?

It was a legal event, allowed by our health authorities. You think Djokovic calls the shots in Croatia?

And that was not the only sporting event at the time in Croatia. Also elections were held early to take advantage of the summer. It was summer, number of infections deceased and frankly we didn't have real COVID outbreak in 2020 spring anyway, due to
early shutdown.

Real COVID started here in late 2020.




Bottom line, why do you (in broad sense westerners) think it was Djokovic's failure or responsibility for pushing to have such event?

Bizarre.

Anyway end of the day it may have been a positive outcome for Novak. He want past Fed/Nadal in slam race and even won gold medal this year. This may or may not have happened had he played all the way through with no breaks to recharge etc. Nobody

knows.


Yes.

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Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> Wrote in message:

Diverting here, I've been playing around with the idea that, just as many words have "evolved" from their original meanings in common popular usage--e.g., "phobia" originally meaning "fear of", but now can mean "someone who strongly dislikes", as in "

Islamaphobia"--



Yeah, or homophobia and many others.



It's also interesting to note what Jews did here?

They use several words and terms that relate to them, but the terms are often not easily connected. It enables them to weasel out.


E.g. if someone accuses you of islamophobia under current meaning (e.g. you hate Moslems) at least you can pinpoint the fact that e.g. Moslems do some shit and thus you justify yourself.



With Jews it's not so straightforward as they use several terms for them.

Language: Hebrew
Country: Israel
People: Jews
Religion: Judaism
Hatred: anti-Semitism


Compare that to e.g. Russians who can't escape?

Language: Russian
Country: Russia
People: Russians *
Religion: Russian orthodox Christianity
Hatred: russophobia


So if someone accuses you of russophobia e.g. for removing Dostoyevsky or Tchaikovsky or Medvedev from Wimbledon, you can easily at least justify that by drawing paralels to "bad Russia under Putin".

Russians have not planned escape routes as Jews have done.


Otoh when you point to the fact Israel has killed 40 thousand people in the last year, half of it children, then they, even if they acknowledge it, will likewise say, but don't attack all Jews because of it.

And when you point out to the fact that Jews dominate US politics, and have infiltrated in top echelons there, they will say, Israel has nothing to do with that.

If you think it's related, you're an anti-Semite.

A word that has no true meaning (Arabs are Semites too) and is simply used as a major slur in English language for those whom Jews dislike them.







* Russians actually have two words for themselves, just as Croats and Serbs.

The thing is, our variants are recognised in English, I'm not so sure about Russian.


Here's the thing.

Both you and Djokovic are Serbs, but only Djokovic is Serbian.


For Russia (Rossiya).

Ruskies would be true Slavic Russians.
Rossiyane would be any citizen of Russia.

So russkie is something like a WASP in your case?

You can see all this coming around again, and it looks like the US, at ~250 years of a republican form of government, is about ready to drift toward monarchy to combat oligarchy.

It's normal and natural.

Nobles are scum. They enjoy luxury and easy life without no responsibility.

Only a patriotic leader can fight for the people and crush the nobility.


We all cheer for one true leader and king to dominate his rivals and subjugate his enemies to help the peasants.

You can see it in tennis too.

We the tennis fans (peasants) all enjoyed and wanted to see (insert any of the big 3 depending on your taste) dominating the pretenders, the nobles, guys like Berdych, Ferrer, Tsonga, Dimitrov, Raonic, Tsitsipas, etc.

Peasants rely on powerful king.


Chinese have Xi.
Slavs have Putin.
Hindus have Modi.
Persians have Ayatollah.

Anglos, Germanics have Soros and the Jews.


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On 10/5/2024 1:10 PM, jdeluise wrote:

*skriptis <skriptis@post.t-com.hr> writes:

You have reading and comprehension issues.

Of course you won't post anything factual, just your standard beta
bitch whining "hah I caught you in hypocrisy".

For some reason you think you've won all arguments when you do that,
it's hilarious, reality check you win none, you're laughing stock when
you do that.

Well, someone has to reveal how hollow and inconsistent your (many)
words are on every topic.  Saw and Whisper aren't going to do it, they
both have a weakness for flattery and you've put in a lot of good years extensively fluffing their egos.  Kinda like a beta, or in your case a perennial cuck.

Perhaps, and I exclude Whisper in this discussion... But I am curious
why Sawfish never followed up with a reply to the reasons I am a
Libertarian...
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Scall5

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On 10/5/2024 8:46 PM, Sawfish wrote:

On 10/5/24 6:00 PM, Scall5 wrote:

On 10/5/2024 1:10 PM, jdeluise wrote:

*skriptis <skriptis@post.t-com.hr> writes:

You have reading and comprehension issues.

Of course you won't post anything factual, just your standard beta
bitch whining "hah I caught you in hypocrisy".

For some reason you think you've won all arguments when you do that,
it's hilarious, reality check you win none, you're laughing stock
when you do that.

Well, someone has to reveal how hollow and inconsistent your (many)
words are on every topic.  Saw and Whisper aren't going to do it,
they both have a weakness for flattery and you've put in a lot of
good years extensively fluffing their egos.  Kinda like a beta, or in
your case a perennial cuck.

Perhaps, and I exclude Whisper in this discussion... But I am curious
why Sawfish never followed up with a reply to the reasons I am a
Libertarian...

Well, I understood it to be your personal political philosophy, you have
come across for years as a basically honest and decent guy, so your
reasons seem to me to be your own business.

It goes without saying that my own views are different, but not
diametrically opposed. I don't see any point in arguing about the way
you want to structure your life plans.

Valid point you have Sawfish. Thanks for the follow up!
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Scall5

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On 10/8/2024 10:54 AM, jdeluise wrote:

Scall5 <nospam@home.net> writes:

Valid point you have Sawfish. Thanks for the follow up!

As a libertarian, do you feel the federal government should be providing
any assistance for the devastation from Helene, and soon from Milton?

Well the USA Federal Government has been (supposedly) taxing it's
citizens to support agencies like FMEA to aid those in distress. So yes,
FMEA needs to stand up BIG time and offer aid in times like this.

That being said, anytime the Federal Government (or individual states
for that matter) create a tax to *only* fund a single entity it quickly
is a stash fund for the GOP/Democrat Duopoly to raid monies for other reelection items. Social Security is a great example. Even in the early
1980's Reagan was mentioning that Social Security was being raided for
other federal expenditures.

State run lotteries are another example of state's mismanagement. "It
will only go to the schools and first responders". So people vote in a
lottery system. A decade later the funds are being used who knows where?
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Scall5

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